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Zero
Just had a text, they get the first pick in draft.
Eagle2720
Good that we got it, but kinda upset about it at the same time. I want either Dunn or Hield. Both of which would be considered career ending picks while Simmons and Ingram are there. I'm not too thrilled about either of them. We'll see what happens though.
nephillymike
Hopefully we'll get an elite player.

Shame we didn't get the LAL pick.
Zero
Link
Reality Fan
Give me Ingram.......

Simmons is a problem looking for a place to happen....more concerned about Nike or Addidas than working on his game and he said he wants to play in LA.....they can have him....he sucked the 2nd half of the season to boot
Joegrane
To be a championship contender you seem to need a NBA MVP candidate and at least one other All-Star caliber player.

Unless Embiid has a miracle recovery, they don't seem to have either of the two.

Will they get one of the two @#1 this year? My impression is that there are no obvious perennial All Stars at the top of the draft.

A sports writer wrote, “'The Process paid off." I strongly disagree.

I think history will say that Hinkie's process failed to get the elite player a team needs to be a championship contender. I think some bad luck was involved but tanking is not a guarantee of great success later.

I think history will show that getting Okafor instead of Porzingis was a costly mistake.

Obviously, someone picked much later can develop into an All-Star. Philly's Kyle Lowry is an example. However the Sixers have a lot of work to do in order to even be an average team, and they have been bad for too long.

Maybe the delay in getting the LA pick is not so bad. It will give them some time to assess their current questionable players, especially Embiid.

Any chance that they trade one of the Centers during the draft?

QUOTE (Zero @ May 17 2016, 08:35 PM) *
Just had a text, they get the first pick in draft.
Joegrane
It stinks that we have to endure the "tank" only to get the #1 in a year when there isn't a true #1 or even #2. They all have holes in their game.

I don't like players who can't shoot. I'm probably influenced by watching Villanova basketball where they typically have 4 guys who can shoot the three and a defensive-minded PF/C.

I would either pick Ingram or trade the pick. Eventually they have to start building their back court. They don't have enough PT to develop any more Bigs.

QUOTE (Zero @ May 17 2016, 08:35 PM) *
Just had a text, they get the first pick in draft.

Reality Fan
QUOTE (Joegrane @ May 18 2016, 10:06 AM) *
It stinks that we have to endure the "tank" only to get the #1 in a year when there isn't a true #1 or even #2. They all have holes in their game.

I don't like players who can't shoot. I'm probably influenced by watching Villanova basketball where they typically have 4 guys who can shoot the three and a defensive-minded PF/C.

I would either pick Ingram or trade the pick. Eventually they have to start building their back court. They don't have enough PT to develop any more Bigs.


I have to humbly disagree. It is not a deep draft but Ingram is a special player, particularly considering he is still growing and maturing. He is certainly a 1 or a 2, he is a like a young Durant. Simmons is also a stud or could be but he seems to have little passion for the game except for how it can enrich him.

I almost choked when you said "or trade the pick". You must not be in the area. If they trade the number 1 pick what is left of the fans will burn the arena to the ground. Ingram will be their guy.

D Rock
I'm all in for Ingram too. We need perimeter shooting more than anything. Ingram is a better scorer and a better defender than Simons, and he's younger. But, the x factor for me is that Simons showed a work effort that falls short of what it takes to be an NBA great. I also don't discount having learned under Coach K.

It's an easy choice for me, for these Sixers.

Question: Do we now get LA's pick next year? It was top 5 protected last year, top 3 protected this year. So is it totally unprotected next?
mcnabbulous
QUOTE (D Rock @ May 18 2016, 10:19 AM) *
So is it totally unprotected next?

I could be wrong, but I don't think it's totally unprotected until 2018. Not sure what the status is for next year.
D Rock
Yes, you are correct. I just read it's top 3 protected again next year, then ours outright in 2018.

I fucking hate the Lakers every bit as much as I do the cowboys.

Fortunately, they'll suck balls for a few years, so whenever we get that pick is should be top 5 ish.

I think it may benefit us in the end pushing it forward another year or 2. This draft's top 10 is weak after Simmons and Ingram. I would prefer they got #3 rather than 2 though...
nephillymike
QUOTE (D Rock @ May 18 2016, 11:38 AM) *
Yes, you are correct. I just read it's top 3 protected again next year, then ours outright in 2018.

I fucking hate the Lakers every bit as much as I do the cowboys.

Fortunately, they'll suck balls for a few years, so whenever we get that pick is should be top 5 ish.

I think it may benefit us in the end pushing it forward another year or 2. This draft's top 10 is weak after Simmons and Ingram. I would prefer they got #3 rather than 2 though...



I would prefer they got #3 rather than 2 though...

Why?
Joegrane
I was not thinking about a trade for multiple future picks, but rather, a package of Okafor and picks for young but talented players in an attempt to move up the rebuild.

For example, current playoff caliber picks might have a superabundance of wings and guards from picking in the teens for years. They may need a Center.

Obviously these types of trades are unlikely but so is what happened at #1 and #2 in the NFL draft.

It was not that many years ago that the Sixers made a risky trade for a Center. Of course that blew up on them.

QUOTE (Reality Fan @ May 18 2016, 10:54 AM) *
...I almost choked when you said "or trade the pick". You must not be in the area. If they trade the number 1 pick what is left of the fans will burn the arena to the ground. Ingram will be their guy.
nephillymike
There's talk of trading Okafor to BOS for the 3rd pick in this year's draft.

They don't think Okafor and Noel, Embiid are a good fit and Oke can't play a lick of defense.

Also, thought is that they need and answer from Sarrich (sp?) to see if he's coming over as he may have some of the same skill as Simmons, which may lead them to take Ingram.

I do agree they need an answer from Sarrich.

The assumption is they can make Simmons into a shooter. Doesn't always happen (see MC Williams)
Zero
QUOTE (nephillymike @ May 19 2016, 06:25 AM) *
There's talk of trading Okafor to BOS for the 3rd pick in this year's draft.

They don't think Okafor and Noel, Embiid are a good fit and Oke can't play a lick of defense.

Also, thought is that they need and answer from Sarrich (sp?) to see if he's coming over as he may have some of the same skill as Simmons, which may lead them to take Ingram.

I do agree they need an answer from Sarrich.

The assumption is they can make Simmons into a shooter. Doesn't always happen (see MC Williams)

But will Embiid ever play? Okafor is young and can learn D?
D Rock
QUOTE (nephillymike @ May 19 2016, 01:42 AM) *
I would prefer they got #3 rather than 2 though...

Why?

So they wouldn't get Simmons or Ingram. A lesser pick now, means a higher draft pick when it comes to us.
Joegrane
Coach K taught him, he just wants to play O.

Trade him. I'd give Bos another 1st rounder--#26 as a thank you present for taking him. I don't like Bigs who won't play D as much as I dislike NFL DBs who won't provide run support. I'll take my chances with JE and NN.

Then they could select Hield or Dunn for their back court.

They'll have two lottery picks next year to get a backup PF/C if Embiid flames out.

Gotta love the length on the front line with Saric and Ingram. Both wings can shoot the 3. The lane will be wide open. Therefore they won't need guys at the 1 and 2 who are great at getting into the lane. If they can shoot an open 3, they'll get opportunities.

QUOTE (Zero @ May 19 2016, 08:11 AM) *
But will Embiid ever play? Okafor is young and can learn D?
D Rock
QUOTE (Joegrane @ May 19 2016, 10:49 PM) *
Coach K taught him, he just wants to play O.

Trade him. I'd give Bos another 1st rounder--#26 as a thank you present for taking him. I don't like Bigs who won't play D as much as I dislike NFL DBs who won't provide run support. I'll take my chances with JE and NN.

Then they could select Hield or Dunn for their back court.

Gotta love the length on the front line with Saric and Ingram. Both wings can shoot the 3. The lane will be wide open. Therefore they won't need guys at the 1 and 2 who are great at getting into the lane. If they can shoot an open 3, they'll get opportunities.

Agreed. Send Okfor to Boston and go Heild at#3. We need shooting. I'm warming up to Simmons now after watching some Ingram. He's too damn skinny. Can't elevate in traffic. Simmons only flaw is he's not a great shooter, but it's not like he can't shoot. Starting Joel, Simmons, Saric, Heild, & Smith would be a nice look. Noel can spell 5 and 4, Grant 4 and 3, Covington 3 and 2. That's not a bad start to a roster.
Reality Fan
QUOTE (D Rock @ May 19 2016, 06:12 PM) *
Agreed. Send Okfor to Boston and go Heild at#3. We need shooting. I'm warming up to Simmons now after watching some Ingram. He's too damn skinny. Can't elevate in traffic. Simmons only flaw is he's not a great shooter, but it's not like he can't shoot. Starting Joel, Simmons, Saric, Heild, & Smith would be a nice look. Noel can spell 5 and 4, Grant 4 and 3, Covington 3 and 2. That's not a bad start to a roster.


Ingram is skinny? You mean like Kevin Durant?

It certainly is like Simmons can't shoot....he has zero and I mean zero range. He is great int he post, excellent touch but he is worthless beyond 8-10 feet. WHy do you think he only took 3 three pointers last year. His shooting range or lack thereof is his biggest knock.

I do agree that is Saric is coming over than Ingram is likely not coming here. They will be the same even though Ingram has a likely higher upside. The kid is a stud.

I want to know if any of these trade rumors are bullshit of have some validity. .
D Rock
QUOTE (Reality Fan @ May 20 2016, 02:28 AM) *
Ingram is skinny? You mean like Kevin Durant?

It certainly is like Simmons can't shoot....he has zero and I mean zero range. He is great int he post, excellent touch but he is worthless beyond 8-10 feet. WHy do you think he only took 3 three pointers last year. His shooting range or lack thereof is his biggest knock.

I do agree that is Saric is coming over than Ingram is likely not coming here. They will be the same even though Ingram has a likely higher upside. The kid is a stud.

No. I don't mean like Kevin Durant. I mean the kid can't finish w contact, can't elevate in traffic (has to settle, gather, before getting any ups).

Saric is much stronger. I like Ingram in 3 years, where as Simmons is ready to go now, and will only still get bigger and stronger.

And yes, he can shoot. He's money from 12 in and can keep a defense honest from 15.
Reality Fan
QUOTE (D Rock @ May 19 2016, 10:26 PM) *
No. I don't mean like Kevin Durant. I mean the kid can't finish w contact, can't elevate in traffic (has to settle, gather, before getting any ups).

Saric is much stronger. I like Ingram in 3 years, where as Simmons is ready to go now, and will only still get bigger and stronger.

And yes, he can shoot. He's money from 12 in and can keep a defense honest from 15.


ok...I guess all the experts pointing out he has zero range are wrong...teams literally defended him with a game plan of making him shoot from the perimeter...they actually dared him to shoot...do you follow college basketball at all?

I suggest you read the scouting....since you obviously have not watched him in games. The guy can handle the ball and can score in the paint but he can't play 4 without the threat of a reliable jump shot. In the NBA he will need a perimeter game....he has none right now. The worry is that he will struggle to develop one.

Ingram is like a physical clone of durant...he is an inch shorter but built the same....except, unlike Durant, he can bench 185.....I guess you missed that one....Durant was the only player at the combine who could not bench 185.

Moreover...Ingram will play the wing and can shoot...and his strength is his ability to shoot, dribble and penetrate so he is a mismatch on the wing with his size. As he grows into his body, like Durant did, he will be deadly.
Joegrane
Isn't Saric more of a PF/4 rather than a SF/3?

Reports say he does not have the quickness to guard NBA SFs, does not have ideal strength for a PF and not ideal quickness to easily get to the rim. Supposedly he can shoot but not a great 3 pt shooter.

Next year I expect them to go easy on Embiid. I don't expect him to have the stamina to play many minutes. I assume he won't be on the court for many minutes with NN. That gives Saric plenty of minutes at PF.

QUOTE (Reality Fan @ May 19 2016, 11:41 PM) *
...
Ingram is like a physical clone of durant...he is an inch shorter but built the same....except, unlike Durant, he can bench 185.....I guess you missed that one....Durant was the only player at the combine who could not bench 185.

Moreover...Ingram will play the wing and can shoot...and his strength is his ability to shoot, dribble and penetrate so he is a mismatch on the wing with his size. As he grows into his body, like Durant did, he will be deadly.

Reality Fan
QUOTE (Joegrane @ May 20 2016, 09:29 AM) *
Isn't Saric more of a PF/4 rather than a SF/3?

Reports say he does not have the quickness to guard NBA SFs, does not have ideal strength for a PF and not ideal quickness to easily get to the rim. My guess is that he is definitely a 4 who will need to add strength.

Next year I expect them to go easy on Embiid. I don't expect him to have the stamina to play many minutes. I assume he won't be on the court for many minutes with NN. That gives Saric plenty of minutes at PF.


I am primarily a huge college hoop fan and have had a hard time stomaching the Sixers tank process....I watched them religiously up until this year when the eye ulcers they caused were just too much...which says a lot because I can watch college basketball til the cows come home. You are very right on Saric and that he is not an ideal 4. He reminds me of Tony Kukoc. If he is coming over there seems to be an issue with fitting him, Simmons and either Okafor or Noel into the 4. If Embid is good to go there needs to be a spot for those guys. With 2 years to prepare I am not worried about Embid's stamina....he will be fine.

I am really confused over who they will take.....Brown has strong ties to Simmons.......Ingram seems like a great fit...SImmons has such a great touch in the paint, very soft touch which makes me scratch my head that he is such a subpar shooter outside it. If they take Simmons then what does that mean for Saric who they are spending a lot of time and effort courting? So many damn questions.....lol going to be a fun year.
D Rock
QUOTE (Reality Fan @ May 20 2016, 04:41 AM) *
ok...I guess all the experts pointing out he has zero range are wrong...teams literally defended him with a game plan of making him shoot from the perimeter...they actually dared him to shoot...do you follow college basketball at all?

I suggest you read the scouting....since you obviously have not watched him in games. The guy can handle the ball and can score in the paint but he can't play 4 without the threat of a reliable jump shot. In the NBA he will need a perimeter game....he has none right now. The worry is that he will struggle to develop one.

Ingram is like a physical clone of durant...he is an inch shorter but built the same....except, unlike Durant, he can bench 185.....I guess you missed that one....Durant was the only player at the combine who could not bench 185.

Moreover...Ingram will play the wing and can shoot...and his strength is his ability to shoot, dribble and penetrate so he is a mismatch on the wing with his size. As he grows into his body, like Durant did, he will be deadly.

Durrant's game didn't fall apart in traffic. Ingram does. He doesn't have the explosion in the legs to elevate through contact. He'll get stronger no doubt. But Simmons is ready to contribute on day 1.

Yes, I've watched a ton of cut ups of both players. Simmons, despite what "the experts" who have clearly provided you with your opinion say, the film shows he is money from 12' in. He's got no range beyond that. Yet.
D Rock
QUOTE (Joegrane @ May 20 2016, 02:29 PM) *
Isn't Saric more of a PF/4 rather than a SF/3?

Reports say he does not have the quickness to guard NBA SFs, does not have ideal strength for a PF and not ideal quickness to easily get to the rim. Supposedly he can shoot but not a great 3 pt shooter.

Next year I expect them to go easy on Embiid. I don't expect him to have the stamina to play many minutes. I assume he won't be on the court for many minutes with NN. That gives Saric plenty of minutes at PF.

Yes. Saric is a 4.
Joegrane
It seems that an organization would have to build around Simmons. I assume he would need to be surrounded by 3pt shooters, including at PF. Otherwise he'll get double-teamed or face two Bigs in the lane.

The Sixers don't have those shooters now. Won't that make Simmons much less effective until they do?

In contrast, if Ingram continues to shoot the 3, he will have a job. If he never bulks up, he will still have something that will be a contribution.

If Simmons does not develop the ability to shoot an open 3, I assume he could end up being a 6-10 250lb Tony Wroten clogging up the court when he does not have the ball in his hands. How will that sit with his teammates?

It will be interesting to see if the Sixers want to gamble on "upside" or make the safer pick.

QUOTE (D Rock @ May 20 2016, 12:29 PM) *
Durrant's game didn't fall apart in traffic. Ingram does. He doesn't have the explosion in the legs to elevate through contact. He'll get stronger no doubt. But Simmons is ready to contribute on day 1.

Yes, I've watched a ton of cut ups of both players. Simmons, despite what "the experts" who have clearly provided you with your opinion say, the film shows he is money from 12' in. He's got no range beyond that. Yet.

Reality Fan
QUOTE (D Rock @ May 20 2016, 12:29 PM) *
Durrant's game didn't fall apart in traffic. Ingram does. He doesn't have the explosion in the legs to elevate through contact. He'll get stronger no doubt. But Simmons is ready to contribute on day 1.

Yes, I've watched a ton of cut ups of both players. Simmons, despite what "the experts" who have clearly provided you with your opinion say, the film shows he is money from 12' in. He's got no range beyond that. Yet.


First, Durant was not a power player in traffic in College
Here is his weakness review....
Double teams have proven to trouble him as he doesn’t always read them quick enough … While he is unselfish, he lacks the passing ability to create for his teammates … To his credit he isn’t a terribly poor passer but certainly doesn’t stand out at this point in his career … Defensively he is improving and showing a willingness to improve, but still needs to work on his perimeter defense in terms of his anticipation skills and footwork … Has a tendency to bite on fakes when going for the block, so improvement on his timing and patience will eliminate this … Like most freshmen in college Durant will need to add more weight and body strength. He probably will always be on the slim side due to his narrow chest, but it shouldn't hinder him much except finishing inside … Doesn’t always take full advantage of mismatches, often Durant will settle for the outside jumper, granted it's not a horrible alternative … Body strength doesn’t allow him to finish after contact … Despite being such a dominate offensive force, Durant can go through stretches of games where he appears fatigued and won’t demand the ball … Gets pushed out rather easily on rebounds due to his body strength … Although not a major flaw, it should be noted that Durant operates primarily on the right side of the floor … Ball protection will need to be worked on as he can get careless with the ball …

or

Weaknesses: Hasn't been fully tested in terms of competition. Does he have the fire inside to maximize his abilities and develop a killer instinct? He has a laid back demeanor; will he continue to work hard after he starts cashing 7 figure checks? … Defensively, he's very lax. Tends to be too upright, and should focus more on his defensive fundamentals, getting low in his defensive stance, especially on the perimeter … Has all the potential to be a lock down defender, but doesn't put the effort in on that side of the ball … Still needs to bulk up, although he has bulked up significantly since high school. May always be skinny and adding too much weight could slow his foot speed some … Adding weight will make him more aggressive inside, as he tends to shy away from contact and can be pushed around and affected when played physical … Ball handling could still use refinement, as he is a little too high in his dribble … Shows flashes of great passing but is inconsistent … Should block more shots with his length and athleticism … Can improve upon the nuances of the game, moving without the ball, understanding where to be in help defense situations, giving equal effort on both ends of the floor etc.

I loved watching Texas because of Lamarcus Aldridge so it was fun to watch Durant follow him....I saw quite a few of both their games. Durant was a shooter, to suggest otherwise is ridiculous or indicative of someone who has seen little of his college game.

I din't watch a ton of cut ups....I watched actual games. I admit I have seen less of SImmons but I did see several games. I do actually read expert reports....I don't base my opinion on that alone, that would be as stupid as basing an opinion on highlight reels. If you can find a highlight reel of Simmons shooting outside I would love to see it.

I love the "I say it so it must be so" guys around here...does anyone ever think to stop and rearch something they have never seen before? The ironic thing is that you are basing your opinion on highlight reels and then try to be a dick about what I base my opinion on without having a clue. As fat as talking points...I am sure you came up with your " explosion in the legs to elevate through contact" on your own about a guy you only saw in "cut ups". Too damn funny.

Ingram was easy to watch a lot because he played for Duke who was on all the time.
Reality Fan
QUOTE (Joegrane @ May 20 2016, 02:12 PM) *
It seems that an organization would have to build around Simmons. I assume he would need to be surrounded by 3pt shooters, including at PF. Otherwise he'll get double-teamed or face two Bigs in the lane.

The Sixers don't have those shooters now. Won't that make Simmons much less effective until they do?

In contrast, if Ingram continues to shoot the 3, he will have a job. If he never bulks up, he will still have something that will be a contribution.

If Simmons does not develop the ability to shoot an open 3, I assume he could end up being a 6-10 250lb Tony Wroten clogging up the court when he does not have the ball in his hands. How will that sit with his teammates?

It will be interesting to see if the Sixers want to gamble on "upside" or make the safer pick.


Simmons would play the 4 and be one of the few with no outside shot. He may develop one over the years but he does not have one now. Your point about building around him is valid though.

Ingram will only bulk up so much...like Durant...but Durant significantly increased his strength. Remember, Durant could not bench 185 at the combine....he is much stronger now.

It really is a crap shoot to guess who they take...kind of makes it fun.
nephillymike
I heard on the radio today that Saric plays the point forward position that they think Simmons will play.

BTW, what is the deal with Saric?

When does he have to "declare" to play this year?

It would be nice to know what he is doing before the draft.

Also, he can never come over right?

They always mention him as a good Hinkie pick but he may never come over.
Reality Fan
There was a report today that it was in the Serbian paper that he has said he is playing in the NBA next year.

For whatever that is worth.
Joegrane
That is my understanding as well. He is good on the break for a PF and likes the ball in his hands. He is a good passer.

Why would he turn down the NBA $? The question is about the rookie pay scale. I think if he stays out of the NBA for one more year, he stands to make more $ when he comes in.

This article suggests that he is coming this season.
http://www.csnphilly.com/philadelphia-sixe...ish-team-sixers

Colangelo interview explains the situation well.
http://www.csnphilly.com/video/will-dario-...ers-next-season

This is an interesting analysis of his strengths and weaknesses.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GcLH2EqzB0w

Coach B Brown on Saric
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JOrIYFBLv5Q

Encouraging quote
http://www.hoopsrumors.com/dario-saric

This guy thinks Saric would be a top 5 pick in this year's weak draft class. Apparently the improved 37% 3pt shooting is one reason. I wonder if that will hold up or even improve in the NBA where he won't be the best player on the team and presumably won't have to take as many shots as the shot clock expires.
http://www.libertyballers.com/2016/2/1/10868262/article

QUOTE (nephillymike @ May 20 2016, 10:18 PM) *
I heard on the radio today that Saric plays the point forward position that they think Simmons will play.

BTW, what is the deal with Saric?

When does he have to "declare" to play this year?

It would be nice to know what he is doing before the draft.

Also, he can never come over right?

They always mention him as a good Hinkie pick but he may never come over.
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