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nephillymike
Both came across well in the post game press conference.

I still think this is a good offense.

I liked the audibles option. Bradford said the difference was to take away some negative plays.

We need him to run the ball a few times in this offense.

Wasn't happy with Murray's load even with the long TD.

Bradford played a real good game. Missed the TD pass to Cooper which we ended up not needing, but otherwise played well and was very accurate. And maybe 90% of the WR's are far enough away that it is a TD, but you got to know your cast. But man does Cooper suck.

He is making the decision difficult.

Curious as to why so much Barner.

OTOH, our D gave up 505 yards.

We always say our best players are on D, but man they suck!

BUF won, so we move up one spot.

HOping that OAK wins and we may get up to 13ish from 15ish.

The long offseason begins.

At least with a new coach it will be interesting.

Zero
Man, if Agholor stops being a lost rookie he could be very good.
Reality Fan
QUOTE (nephillymike @ Jan 3 2016, 04:48 PM) *
OTOH, our D gave up 505 yards.

We always say our best players are on D, but man they suck!


The players are playing under Davis....can't help but fail.....thank god he is gone....the ball boy could take over and they would be better....this defense over the last 3 years is historically bad.....
nephillymike
QUOTE (Reality Fan @ Jan 3 2016, 05:40 PM) *
The players are playing under Davis....can't help but fail.....thank god he is gone....the ball boy could take over and they would be better....this defense over the last 3 years is historically bad.....


Sad but true
nd9kel
So, Shumer endorses Bradford. Bradford is very high on Shurmer. Sounds like the team is pretty well unanimous on Bradford for next year, and I'm hearing positive statements from the rest of the team concerning Shumer. Like Nephillymike I think the ability to audible makes a HUGE difference in this offense. Bradford would make a realistic decision in order to have Shumer take the reins. I really believe this. Nobody has gotten more out of him. Twice.

I think Shumer will make the improvements all the psycho Philly fans want. Why miss a beat? Get him hired.

As for the defense, I'll leave that to you other experts to "fix."
Reality Fan
Is it just me or is it simply insane that Kelly did not have audibles? In the NFL? now that is a control freak cutting off his nose to spite his face....christ, we had audibles in high school....

how did it take 3 years for the beat writers in Philly to realize this?
nephillymike
QUOTE (Reality Fan @ Jan 3 2016, 08:42 PM) *
Is it just me or is it simply insane that Kelly did not have audibles? In the NFL? now that is a control freak cutting off his nose to spite his face....christ, we had audibles in high school....

how did it take 3 years for the beat writers in Philly to realize this?



I know, hard to believe Harry!
Joegrane
quote 'nephillymike:

I still think this is a good offense.

++ If they just had a little more on the O LIne and one #2 caliber WR. However the Giants D is terrible.

I liked the audibles option. Bradford said the difference was to take away some negative plays.

++ agree

We need him to run the ball a few times in this offense.

++ agree. It could be an option on the rollout they use and occasionally something designed. He is not stupid about exposing himself.

Wasn't happy with Murray's load even with the long TD.

++ wow did that TD run make Chip look bad! It probably was mostly coincidence but...

Bradford played a real good game. Missed the TD pass to Cooper which we ended up not needing,

++ How does he overthrow cooper in that situation. It is single coverage. He can throw it to Coop's right and throw it up for him to run under. Coop was a center fielder. That is the only thing he does well as a receiver. It was a perfect situation for it. If the DB intercepts it is almost like a punt except the seconds that don't come off the clock.

but otherwise played well and was very accurate.

++ Yes impressive even though it was the Giant's depleted D. The passes were usually on the mark. How do you not resign Bradford. He is going to be an above average QB with an average cast around him.


Curious as to why so much Barner.

++ Maybe to help with decision about next year. I don't think he has done anything to make the team keep him.


The long offseason begins.

++ Not so long since there will be lots of news on coaches, front office changes, free agents.

At least with a new coach it will be interesting.

++ Can't say I remember it that way after controverial Buddy Ryan got booted out of town. So many of the team's top talent left as well.

++ I really fear we could be at the beginning of a stretch of mediocrity for this organization. Young people have only known a competitive Eagles organization. That could be changing. I'll predict that if Bradford does not sign the Eagles will disintegrate into an average or below team for five years.

++ Joe
[/quote]
nephillymike
Regarding that Murray run,

Any doubt that Mathews, Sproles or Barner score there, only two seconds sooner?

I'm glad he scored, and I'd like him to do well, btu I just don't see him being better than the other three.

With his cap hit, we're stuck with him for next year as nobody would trade for him.
Reality Fan
QUOTE (nephillymike @ Jan 4 2016, 12:15 AM) *
Regarding that Murray run,

Any doubt that Mathews, Sproles or Barner score there, only two seconds sooner?

I'm glad he scored, and I'd like him to do well, btu I just don't see him being better than the other three.

With his cap hit, we're stuck with him for next year as nobody would trade for him.



you are relentless...you just can't be happy......he outran the Giants db and he has looked fast running...since he got over his hammy in the early season it has not been his speed...it has been his decision making.....he misses holes that Matthews and Sproles don't....as in he is overthinking it...

Don't you wonder why virtually everyone outside of Philly said it was the scheme and not the player? Only in Philly do you hear that silliness....because he is moving well...he unfortunately is so screwed in the head from Kelly that he looks lost at times...

You are the guy Schmidtty meant when describing Philly fans...
make_it_rain
QUOTE (nephillymike @ Jan 3 2016, 05:48 PM) *
Bradford played a real good game. Missed the TD pass to Cooper which we ended up not needing, but otherwise played well and was very accurate. And maybe 90% of the WR's are far enough away that it is a TD, but you got to know your cast. But man does Cooper suck.

He is making the decision difficult.


There really isn't much of a decision. Theyve got to find a way to keep Bradford. If it means tagging him, so be it. The last seven games he has been very solid, at the least good enough to separate himself from the other options out there. The QB class in the draft is so so, and even assuming one is still available at 13 there are more pressing issues to use with that first rounder (esp given the lack of a second) with a solid option available in Bradford.

The one big complication (esp if they franchise him) is there are a lot of people set to be FA....Thornton, Thurmond, Curry etc. It would also be wise to work out an extension with Cox (they picked up the option for next year, so its not like he can leave next year, but it would likely be cheaper to extend him now). I'm not sure how you can keep Bradford and all of them.
mcnabbulous
It's pretty simple. We let the new HC determine if they want Sam to have more time in Philly. It's the one position where a HC should be granted personnel say.
BirdsWinBaby
QUOTE (make_it_rain @ Jan 4 2016, 01:36 PM) *
There really isn't much of a decision. Theyve got to find a way to keep Bradford. If it means tagging him, so be it.


Bradford played this whole season with FA in mind. Try to franchise tag him and it will be a nightmare. It will piss him off, and he can refuse to play with the tag. He gambled on himself and his health and won. He will be unlikely to allow the team to take away that prize.

Bradford already risked himself for this team for one year with no security....no agent would let him do it for two years

Now if you try to tag Bradford and he holds out.....your brand new coach is saddled with no QB and a black cloud hanging over the team as the story drags on and on until they take back the tag and move on to stop the bad press
HobbEs
Yesterday was the best the Offense looked all year. To me it seemed that they slowed it down a bit and I loved the fact that Bradford was allowed to audible. After that I certainly wouldn't be upset if Shurmer stayed on in some capacity.
D Rock
QUOTE (Reality Fan @ Jan 4 2016, 09:22 AM) *
you are relentless...you just can't be happy......he outran the Giants db and he has looked fast running...since he got over his hammy in the early season it has not been his speed...it has been his decision making.....he misses holes that Matthews and Sproles don't....as in he is overthinking it...

Don't you wonder why virtually everyone outside of Philly said it was the scheme and not the player? Only in Philly do you hear that silliness....because he is moving well...he unfortunately is so screwed in the head from Kelly that he looks lost at times...

You are the guy Schmidtty meant when describing Philly fans...

But for the annoying FACT that Murray had a better yards per carry running from the gun than he did running with the QB under center.

CT_Eagle
QUOTE (mcnabbulous @ Jan 4 2016, 06:59 PM) *
It's pretty simple. We let the new HC determine if they want Sam to have more time in Philly. It's the one position where a HC should be granted personnel say.


Agree 100%

You don't bring in a new HC and tell him he has to hang his hat on a QB he may not want.
CT_Eagle
QUOTE (HobbEs @ Jan 4 2016, 07:24 PM) *
Yesterday was the best the Offense looked all year. To me it seemed that they slowed it down a bit and I loved the fact that Bradford was allowed to audible. After that I certainly wouldn't be upset if Shurmer stayed on in some capacity.



Agree but the Eagles played probably the worse defense in the NFL on Sunday so I will take the performance with a grain of salt. I really enjoyed seeing a drive last longer than 5 minutes and the audibles were refreshing as well. Hopefully the next HC keeps some elements of Chip's offense. Running a more traditional offense then breaking out the up-tempo offense at key points of a game would be tough to plan for.
Eyrie
QUOTE (Reality Fan @ Jan 4 2016, 01:42 AM) *
Is it just me or is it simply insane that Kelly did not have audibles? In the NFL? now that is a control freak cutting off his nose to spite his face....christ, we had audibles in high school....

how did it take 3 years for the beat writers in Philly to realize this?

I think we've mentioned that before on here.

The fast pace should disorientate the defence, so an audible gives the QB the opportunity to exploit that based on what he sees at the line. I can only assume that Kelly was too much of a control freak to delegate that much decision making.
SAM I Am
QUOTE (BirdsWinBaby @ Jan 4 2016, 01:08 PM) *
Bradford played this whole season with FA in mind. Try to franchise tag him and it will be a nightmare. It will piss him off, and he can refuse to play with the tag. He gambled on himself and his health and won. He will be unlikely to allow the team to take away that prize.

Bradford already risked himself for this team for one year with no security....no agent would let him do it for two years

Now if you try to tag Bradford and he holds out.....your brand new coach is saddled with no QB and a black cloud hanging over the team as the story drags on and on until they take back the tag and move on to stop the bad press

Bradford didn't play this season with free agency in mind. He played this season hoping he would be able to stay healthy and play well enough to show teams he could still be a starting QB somewhere in the NFL.

I franchise tag him. I'm not ready to give him a long term deal just yet. Tag him and let's see where he is at about three quarters of the way through the season, then go from there.

I seriously doubt he will sit out the year and pass up about 20 milliion dollars. That would be insane.

As for any bad press, fuck that, I couldn't care less what the press thinks or says.
samaroo
QUOTE (SAM I Am @ Jan 5 2016, 05:49 AM) *
Bradford didn't play this season with free agency in mind. He played this season hoping he would be able to stay healthy and play well enough to show teams he could still be a starting QB somewhere in the NFL.


I think that's exactly what he meant by "FA on his mind." He needed to play well this year to get paid, not necessarily to leave Philly.

We need to keep Bradford. Keeping him is the difference between a 1-2 year turnaround and a 5 year turnaround.
BirdsWinBaby
QUOTE (SAM I Am @ Jan 4 2016, 04:49 PM) *
I seriously doubt he will sit out the year and pass up about 20 milliion dollars. That would be insane.


players have walked away from the tag...even QBs. Bradford played well enough to demand security. he will command a ton more than $20mill if he holds out until he gets a contract

the franchise tag always benefits (and protects) the team so i see why you want it.....but after giving the eagles a year to see what he can do, Bradford would be insane to give away his leverage

the Eagles have no QB....so Bradford would be wise to say, "you want me?....4-5yrs/$17-21m per/$40guaranteed....or the franchise will go to Sanchize"

maybe you dont care about bad press...maybe Lurie wont either....so when it comes (in addition to losing games with no QB) i hope its worth it to him
BirdsWinBaby
im not saying i think Bradford is worth that kind of money....im not his biggest fan, im just saying that the "lets see what we have in Bradford before we commit to him" thing was what this year was for

he wont bail the Eagles out by doing it again
nephillymike
QUOTE (BirdsWinBaby @ Jan 4 2016, 01:08 PM) *
Bradford played this whole season with FA in mind. Try to franchise tag him and it will be a nightmare. It will piss him off, and he can refuse to play with the tag. He gambled on himself and his health and won. He will be unlikely to allow the team to take away that prize.

Bradford already risked himself for this team for one year with no security....no agent would let him do it for two years

Now if you try to tag Bradford and he holds out.....your brand new coach is saddled with no QB and a black cloud hanging over the team as the story drags on and on until they take back the tag and move on to stop the bad press


This is probably true.

I can't see the tag being appealing for him.

The $23Mish cap hit would hurt us.

It means we aren't sure about him.

Not the message they new regime will want to give.

They'll either sign him to a huge deal or let him go.

nephillymike
QUOTE (D Rock @ Jan 4 2016, 02:04 PM) *
But for the annoying FACT that Murray had a better yards per carry running from the gun than he did running with the QB under center.


Funny but True.
nephillymike
QUOTE (Reality Fan @ Jan 4 2016, 04:22 AM) *
you are relentless...you just can't be happy......he outran the Giants db and he has looked fast running...since he got over his hammy in the early season it has not been his speed...it has been his decision making.....he misses holes that Matthews and Sproles don't....as in he is overthinking it...

Don't you wonder why virtually everyone outside of Philly said it was the scheme and not the player? Only in Philly do you hear that silliness....because he is moving well...he unfortunately is so screwed in the head from Kelly that he looks lost at times...

You are the guy Schmidtty meant when describing Philly fans...


Funny you mentioned Schmidt.

I got in a heated discussion as a teen with a Philly fan who was ripping Schmidt. I was defending him I guess it was real early 80's. I pissed him off because I said he was the best 3B of all time (before he was thought to be the best). Don't get me wrong, I'll boo my kids if they don't play well and lack effort, but that day, this idiot just went on and on about Nettles and Cey and Santo, and Allen while booing Schmidt every time.
samaroo
QUOTE (D Rock @ Jan 5 2016, 04:04 AM) *
But for the annoying FACT that Murray had a better yards per carry running from the gun than he did running with the QB under center.


I think this is a bit misleading, due to the fact that when we were under center, the D knew it was a run. But I will also say that Murray's lack of production is one of my least concerns going forward. I think he'll be fine next year.
nd9kel
QUOTE (nephillymike @ Jan 4 2016, 07:10 PM) *
This is probably true.

I can't see the tag being appealing for him.

The $23Mish cap hit would hurt us.

It means we aren't sure about him.

Not the message they new regime will want to give.

They'll either sign him to a huge deal or let him go.


Is that what it meant when Dallas tagged Dez?
Joegrane
I don't see ANY reasonable way the Eagles could "franchise" Bradford. Check out the sobering numbers on their salary cap and free agents.
http://www.wingheads.com/index.php?showtop...rt=#entry281501

In order to afford the 20-something mil$ they'd have to release some players such as B Celek and/or Jason Peters and not resign other current players such as Thornton, Curry and W Thurmund! Check out the numbers.

If they sign Bradford long term, they might be able to keep the first year's cap hit a little lower and then assume Celek and Peters (11mil?) will come off the payroll or be greatly reduced in 2017.

That 9 mil cap hit by D Murray is killing the team--and probably any chance they had to attract top level coaches. I have no idea what J Laurie was doing when he agreed to that deal. He must have been sitting on his calculator. You know Howie did not let the math get passed him.

Sadly Bradford may realize this and decide to go back home to the Southwest--the Texans--similar to what Maclin did last year. He used the Eagles to get a better deal from home-town KC.

QUOTE (BirdsWinBaby @ Jan 4 2016, 06:56 PM) *
players have walked away from the tag...even QBs. Bradford played well enough to demand security. he will command a ton more than $20mill if he holds out until he gets a contract

the franchise tag always benefits (and protects) the team so i see why you want it.....but after giving the eagles a year to see what he can do, Bradford would be insane to give away his leverage

the Eagles have no QB....so Bradford would be wise to say, "you want me?....4-5yrs/$17-21m per/$40guaranteed....or the franchise will go to Sanchize"

maybe you dont care about bad press...maybe Lurie wont either....so when it comes (in addition to losing games with no QB) i hope its worth it to him
D Rock
QUOTE (samaroo @ Jan 5 2016, 03:16 AM) *
I think this is a bit misleading, due to the fact that when we were under center, the D knew it was a run. But I will also say that Murray's lack of production is one of my least concerns going forward. I think he'll be fine next year.

Misleading? It's simply the truth.
Reality Fan
QUOTE (D Rock @ Jan 6 2016, 11:19 AM) *
Misleading? It's simply the truth.


also true is that over the last 4 games Matthews ran for that same lusty 3.5 ypa......

Predictability was the problem Kelly could not get over........With Murray they did the same thing....rarely running play action but rather running every time they were under center...you don't have to be a coach to see the obvious pitfalls in that..
samaroo
Yeah, I just don't think you can point to his lack of production from under center to just say "he sucks," is all. He definitely wasn't good, but I don't think it's a fatal condition. Hopefully predictability was the problem. We shall see. But I, for one, think Murray will rebound with a more "traditional" offense or whatever.
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