I given this a little thought, and have tried to come up with a general sense of principles we might want to follow:

1. The Board belongs to the members, not to a small group - inclusive as possible, open and transparent. While someone has to be in control (anarchy works only in theory, not practice), legitimacy comes from consensus, not command.

2. We want the best of Igglephans, the wide open discourse, the obscene and politically incorrect posts, without the worst, the obnoxious flame wars, insults, disrespect, sorched earth campaigns, 40 year old men acting like 15 year old boys.

3. We will censor, but openly and explain our actions - i.e. we won't tolerate nasty flame wars, if you insult someone, it must be witty, and without malice, no calling people assholes etc. unless it's well understood that it's in jest. Boring and pendantic should be limited by mutual agreement - if you ignore the post it will go away.

4. We don't want people to agree with us, we want a diversity of opinion. The board is a forum, not a club. You can tell people they're full of shit, you just can't tell them they're a piece of shit. If you can't figure out the distinction, there are other boards that don't care.

5. Once you made a point enough times - shut the fuck up (which I hope y'all tell me when needed ).

I certainly would not want a sanitized board, Pila rated posts are fine, as long as a warning is attached - I have no problem with a "R" rated board (or even "X" rated as long as proper warnings and legal niceties are observed ). However, this does not mean if we have a woman poster, you can bombard her with sexual innuendos unless invited, and if she says stop, well, no means no. While a football board inevitably will have a locker room atmosphere, Coach Barnett ain't running this team!

Civility does not mean boring, or conformist, or no fun. It merely means that cyber space does not excuse bad manners, that disagreement is not a mortal offense, that Winning and Losing are something we worry about on the football field, not in our strings.

If civility becomes a norm, then even contentious topics like politics, religion and Eagles management can be discussed without tearing the forum apart. There will no monetary awards provided for "winning" arguments here, nor will we even grant a laural wreath. So there's no point getting so excited you forget your manners - unless of course you really were raised in a pig sty.

Comments, critiques are welcome and invited.

Arlo, good to see you. Run22 here. I have 2 comments on your suggested principles.

First, in response to where you say "no calling people assholes etc. unless it's well understood that it's in jest." Well, part of the problem of electronic communication is that voice inflection, facial expression, etc., don't translate, SO IMO the "well understood" part of your comment is key. People should make sure to make it's very clear when they are ribbing someone and it doesn't get confused without insulting, i.e. make it clear by adding smileys : - ), etc.

Second, I know we don't want to make it a G rated board, but if there is anyway that we can limit (usually works only with mature adults) the amount of profanity, I think this would contribute to a positive mood. Fuck really doesn't hve to be used in EVERY single sentence. Now, I probably curse worse than the average guy, but the amount of FUCK's (and other profanity) used on Igglephans offended even me. Again, I am not saying that we necessarily prohibit cursing like Concrete Field does, but the mood will be much less combative if FUCK is not every other word. Less FUCKs would also add to the level of intelligence. I mean, c'mon, we are at least one step about those rat New Yorkers on the human food chain, let's not act just like 'em.

See ya you later - you fuckin' cocksucker motherfucker asshole pussy shithead cunt bastard fuckin dick...

Seriously, see ya! Run (JaxEagle)

As far as profanity, I think that should be handled by disapproval, not the admins. If it's generally not considered "cool" to go overboard, that should have the required effect (hopefully).

In the end, making a board enjoyable is the responsibility of all posters not to go overboard, and when they inevitably do, to accept constructive criticism of their behavior without knee jerk hostility, but by taking a moment to consider whether indeed they could moderate their behavior.

The "Bar" analogy is a good one - an Eagles board shouldn't be a Fern Bar where everyone talks quietly and respectfully and bores the tears out of each other, but it doesn't have to be a Biker bar either, with some serious psychos pulling guns and knives on each other.

Yeah, just a sports bar. Hopefully the amount of profanity will not be as much as igglephans...

Great start AF.

I'd like to keep profanity at a minimum, but I think it adds a unique flavor to the board to have it allowed. I'm not sure if there is a way to positivly limit it. I think that if a poster goes overboard, an admin should probably step in with an edit, and an explanation.

Anyone else have thoughts or suggestions?

Unless X or Eyrie can tell me otherwise, I don't recall any of the regulars (Barb, Lu, even Nee Cee from back in the Phillynews days) ever complaining about Tim (primary instigator), Jerry, or Ray (Loki) drolling over them.

But if someone were to ever complain, then the admins should act accordingly.

Also, Politics and Religion have always been thought of as dangerous topics at best. If we were to keep any amount of the original crew, it still would be (too many years of ingraining one's thought process).

Agree with what's been said so far. I'd allow the foul language (Steve, shut the fuck up already ) but try not to encourage it. Most people will take their lead from those around them so if there is minimal usage it won't be as frequent as the old place.

Agree on banning religion and politics and I'd take a firm line on pornography - nothing too graphic as that would lower the tone and encourage bad behaviour.

I'll create a 'Politics and Reliegon' forum so we can keep that seperated.

Not sure about porn. I kinda like the porn a bit. Perhaps we can make the Phila Warning a firm rule.

While I was on the concrete board. They have handles listed for people who just join. They had me listed as a lurking bastich. When I posted that I was curious as to how long I'd be listed as a bastich I used bastard and when I was taken back to the link, it listed it as a bastich, so it might actually be good to have a auto filter that changes slang words to similiar ones. That way people aren't hit directly.

I Forgot to post it in the other listing. I really don't think we need more than one forum. I really have never been a fan of jumping among forums to read posts. Then you get into posts being moved and I think it creates more work than is necessary for people. Let me know where funding should be sent, or if you want to wait till the site is sent up.

Had that language barrier problem with Moose's thread on Pravda - referred to myself as an "asshole" only to get it changed automatically to "butthole". Not sure I see the difference and I edited it successfully to "a-hole" so who cares?

i like the multiple forums idea...it DOES work, go look at concretefield's board...i think we should emulate that as far as keeping things organized. that way if someone wants to talk just football, thats all they have to read.

I'm for a separate forum for religion and poltiics. Many will be offended and alienated if it occurs in this forum. By giving it a separate forum, people who come here to talk football won't be offended. And anyone who goes there should know what to expect.

As for porn, we should use the Pila system, but keep it R rated (no actual sex acts). And anyone who gets carried away should be counseled.

Just my opinion.

One thing we're going to need for sure is an editor. Once we've defined all of the parameters, they can put it all into sticky posts that will remain at the top of each forum.

I'll volunteer for that. Gods know I'm no use on the technical side.

Once we've pretty clear we've got everything I'll pull it together and post for everyone's thoughts.

Can the board provide a Scottish to English translation dictionary??

Your probably right about the multiple forums, I'll just have to get used to it and expect to find my posts moved. I like how the concrete board lets you see the original post letting you know it was moved.

Yeah, we cna do that here too.

It's the translation to American that the problem

perfect, I vote for that!!!!!!!!!!

I'll add something to Dutch's post.

I vote that the word "whilst" be banned.

That is all!

nephilly in the ~house!!

Thanks for setting this place up! I feel bad about what went on over there. Can't believe it really. I look forward to the good ole days over here. Let me know if you need anything.

Will do ne, and thanks.

Yo AF,

Are you gonna be posting here exclusively, or will you still be making appearances at Igglephans? I gotta tell you, I'm kinda torn about this new site. I've been lurking along with the various iterations of what was to become Igglephans for about 5 years now, and enjoy many of the personalities that post there. I've even posted a few times. The place offers a small taste of home to an expatriate native Philadelphian.

But I haven't been cool with a lot of the shit going down over there, and when the big-guns came back more ornery than when they left, I started getting turned off. I still check the place out regularly, but I feel kinda...weird there right now. Then again, I feel weird posting to this forum. I remember reading with amused distaste about a "secret portal" established for those who couldn't stand what Igglephans had supposedly become, and now look. I'm *in* a secret portal.

I think this place could be the beginnings of something special, especially with some of the characters already gathering here. Just try to keep Bill from posting. Once that slimy bastard insinuates himself into regular discussion, it's all over. Have you ever noticed how that pompous jerk hijacks every thread he can get his
bony hands on? Yeeeechhh...

this is no secret portal, no need to feel weird!

Yeah, as soon as the new theme is complete, everyone will know about it soon enough.

Ross Smith, who's run an Eagles mailing list for about 10 years now, has the following rules on his list. Obviously a board is different from a list, and norms will vary from group to group, but there might be some parts in it worth considering:

---
The Eagles list has been up and running for a few years now, and
it has enough subscriber and contributors that things get out of hand
quickly when proper etiquette is not observed.

Towards that end here are some guidelines for posting to the
Eagles list. Some are time-honored netiquette, some
are borrowed from similar guidelines from other groups.

1) This is an Eagles mailing list. This doesn't mean every post has
to contain the word Eagles... but it does mean that whatever is
being posted had better have some significance/connection to an
Eagles discussion. Fan, team, player and management concerns are
all fine. Opponent and general NFL discussion is fine as long as
it relates to the Eagles in some way other than "the Eagles are
in the NFL." Making plans to see games, NFL policies regarding
suspending players, salary cap questions are all perfectly legit
things to talk about. Discussing whether Michael Irvin will be found
innocent/guilty of drug charges is *NOT* acceptable. How Irvin being
found guilty/innocent affects the Eagles/NFL is legit.

I realize this is a grey area to many people, and I don't want
to discourage worthwhile conversation, but the general rule of
thumb to follow is: if you even have to question yourself as to
whether your post relates to the Eagles or not, it probably doesn't.
If it isn't Eagles related then it should be sent in e-mail to
whoever you are replying to.

2) If it is private/inappropriate mail (anything not fitting in #1)
don't send it to the list. I'm just like the NFL refs... except I get
the benefit of seeing both the instigator and the reactor. If
someone instigates/taunts/is abusive I will deal with them. If you send more
inappropriate material *to the list*, even if it is "just defending
yourself" I consider that *as bad* a violation as the first, if not
worse because you are simply perpetuating a bad situation. Deal with
it *in e-mail* with the person you have a problem with... do not
send it to the list.

3) I have no problem with abusive language, insults, or derogatory
comments so long as they are not directed at a current or former
list member. "Mike Mamula fucked Elway up so bad he missed the
rest of the game... what a sniveling coward Elway is" is fine.
"How can you be so stupid" referring to another list members post
is not. If you can't see the difference then just don't use any
"foul" language or lob any insults at all. "May I present my penis
for you to suck" is definitely a no-go. "I wonder who blew that ref
to get that call" is fine though.

4) Never, *ever* quote a private e-mail message in a post to the
Eagles list. You can quote any on-line source you want, Usenet,
on-line papers, etc... but private mail is just that... *private*.

5) Never, *ever* suggest in a post to the list that another list member
be removed. And never quote these rules, or any part of them to me.
I wrote them. I will deal with problems as I see fit... list members
have no input, say or control, so don't bother. I will be more tolerant
of long standing, and contributing list members... they have earned it. I
will take track record into account with any decisions I make regarding
how to deal with a problem situation.

Some general netiquette as it applies to posting:

1) [deleted rule on not using confirmation of receipt for list emails]

2) If you have quoted more material than you have written new text,
then you either haven't written enough new text or you have quoted too
much old material. Adding "I agree" or "well said" to 50 lines worth of
someone's post is liable to piss me off, or other people on the
list. Continually pissing me off is *not* a good idea.

3) [deleted rule on not using attachments for list emails]
4) [deleted rule on not sending binaries to the list]
5) [reminder that using the "reply" option sends mail back to the all members when "reply" is used, not just the original poster]

6a) Make appropriate use of smileys. They are the difference between an
insult and just poking fun.

6b) Notice when a smiley is used. Please try to remember the person
wasn't entirely serious.

6c) A smiley is not a license to freely insult or be forgiven for
flame- bait. Be careful of what you say.

I totally agree with these. Good resource TGryn.

3) I have no problem with abusive language, insults, or derogatory
comments so long as they are not directed at a current or former
list member. "Mike Mamula fucked Elway up so bad he missed the
rest of the game... what a sniveling coward Elway is" is fine.
"How can you be so stupid" referring to another list members post
is not. If you can't see the difference then just don't use any
"foul" language or lob any insults at all. "May I present my penis
for you to suck" is definitely a no-go. "I wonder who blew that ref
to get that call" is fine though.

5) Never, *ever* suggest IN A POST to the list that another list member
be removed.

I like the idea of never publiclly suggesting that another member be removed.

I'm too groggy to read all that but I'm sure you guys covered about everything. For me it's pretty simple... respect and courtesy. Use them or get slapped.