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Zero
This is a very simple one. No caveats, no what-if's. Lurie calls you and asks for a yes or no: should they trade Chip to Tennessee for their #1 pick next year?

I said yes. I'd like the idea of a true, talented GM coming in with two premium picks to get the QB and BPA in a need position. Added to the talent that's here they may be moving in the right direction. I also realize I said give him another year in the other poll.
Phits
I'd want more than a #1 pick. Chip leaving means that somebody else will inherit his vision. That means that new person will (likely) have to strip the team down (again) to implement their vision. At minimum, I would rather play out this season and next to see his plans come to fruition or completely crash and burn.
HobbEs
I voted yes. Having two high first round picks would lessen the sting of giving our 2nd rounder to St. Louis. Especially of we get a GM that knows what to do with them.
Eyrie
I'd grab that offer in a heartbeat.

As regards a new HC having to start all over again, we're going to have a new defensive co-ordinator next season and unless Kelly can vastly improve his offseason work, then we'll have another poor roster so will struggle again and he'll be fired after 2016.

Might as well get the #1 pick and start over a year ahead of schedule.
bwc2112
I had to say yes, they tried ,did not work. We the fans jumped on the train. It wrecked. Not all Chips fault . it's just not working.
I used to enjoy green Christmas' , This year living North of Charlotte NC (and wife being a Panthers fan) I guess I get a Blue Christmas.

Happy Holidays All
bwc2112
I had to say yes, they tried ,did not work. We the fans jumped on the train. It wrecked. Not all Chips fault . it's just not working.
I used to enjoy green Christmas' , This year living North of Charlotte NC (and wife being a Panthers fan) I guess I get a Blue Christmas.

Happy Holidays All
nephillymike
I voted yes, fully realizing we may have just traded Chip for Marcus Smith, Nelson Algholor or Danny Watkins.

Knowing my opinion of draft picks speaks volumes of my opinion of Chip.

Get something for him now. By the sounds of the players crying and griping, his value won't be higher.
Reality Fan
Too damn funny.....

We tried...it did not work?

What the fuck....he has been GM for all of 6 months.....Philly fans at their best....

I get critiquing his coaching right now but other than the O line he has done nothing that any GM would not have done.

Zero
QUOTE (Reality Fan @ Dec 3 2015, 10:33 PM) *
Too damn funny.....

We tried...it did not work?

What the fuck....he has been GM for all of 6 months.....Philly fans at their best....

I get critiquing his coaching right now but other than the O line he has done nothing that any GM would not have done.

Even though I agree with that sentiment for me the point is how the players seem to be reacting. It sure looks like he's lost them when players like Jenkins are criticizing the coaching. I think it would be very unusual for a coach who has lost his players to regain them. Coughlin did it, but he has an extensive NFL resume ... who else?
Phits
QUOTE (Zero @ Dec 4 2015, 08:28 AM) *
Even though I agree with that sentiment for me the point is how the players seem to be reacting. It sure looks like he's lost them when players like Jenkins are criticizing the coaching. I think it would be very unusual for a coach who has lost his players to regain them. Coughlin did it, but he has an extensive NFL resume ... who else?

I don't think he was 'criticizing' the coaching staff. He questioned whether players were being held accountable for their play.

QUOTE
"I was kind of from a coaching style, I was brought up a little bit different," Jenkins said following Tuesday's practice at the NovaCare Complex. "Where most mistakes that teammates make or players make were brought up more in a team setting. The approach here is more in the individual rooms and that is by design. A lot of the times when things happen on the defensive side of the ball; if the secondary isn't playing well, those mistakes aren't pointed out in front of the whole entire defense. It's dealt with in the defensive back's room.

"So, a defensive lineman won't necessarily know what the mistakes were or where we need to get better at. For me, I'm a bit of a control freak. I like to know what the mistakes are and where we're trying to get better at. Obviously, Billy (Davis) and the coaching staff feels that's not my place. That's they're right and they handle it a lot differently than I've been used to."

"Me and Billy talk pretty often," Jenkins said. "I've been open about how I feel. But, I'm not a coach. That's fine. I think that this point everybody is obviously frustrated and looking for answers. Everyone is working hard to get it corrected, getting it fixed and putting this behind us.

"For me, I like to know what the specific plan is moving forward. What was the mistake? What are we trying to correct? But, that approach isn't always right. There are one thousand ways to skin a cat. That's just my personal opinion. They expressed to me why we do it the way we do it and I'm completely fine with that."
Zero
He's talking about coaching, coaches and coaching style. I don't see how he's not being critical of how things are being done. He's questioning the approach and he appears to be fingering it as a cause.
Phits
QUOTE (Zero @ Dec 4 2015, 10:17 AM) *
He's talking about coaching, coaches and coaching style. I don't see how he's not being critical of how things are being done. He's questioning the approach and he appears to be fingering it as a cause.

I suppose it's a matter of opinion. The way I heard it, and read the comments (and the clarification from the following day), he feels that players should be reprimanded in front of the group and not just in the privacy of a payer/coach meeting. That lack of accountability isn't what he (Jenkins) has been used to his entire playing career. He feels that a player should own it in front of the team, so that there isn't any finger pointing. It's not about the coaches, per se, it's about how they it when players screw up.

IMO, it's a sign of frustration.....and the media trying to stir the pot.
The Franchise
Wow - half of us think we need to just 'stay the course?'

I would take the Titans 1st pick in a heartbeat - in fact, I'd take their 7th round pick in exchange for Chip. In fact, I'd give them OUR 1st round pick and a lifetime supply of cheesesteaks in exchange for Chip.

It's over people, the experiment has failed. Time to move on.
Eyrie
QUOTE (Reality Fan @ Dec 4 2015, 03:33 AM) *
Too damn funny.....

We tried...it did not work?

What the fuck....he has been GM for all of 6 months.....Philly fans at their best....

I get critiquing his coaching right now but other than the O line he has done nothing that any GM would not have done.

But would another GM have made all of those moves at the same time on a 10-6 team?

You can make a case for each individual move (even Mathis, despite the obvious lack of a replacement) but taken in aggregate there was a clear failing by our GM to look at the bigger picture.
Joegrane
If you have an opportunity to draft a franchise QB, it becomes really tempting.

I voted no, but the franchise QB is more important than the coach. If you have the former, you will attract the latter.

I voted no because I think Chip will be fine over the long term. I don't want to see another rebuild. I'm confident he will bolster the O line in the offseason. That alone will make the team much better.

My perspective on the ultimate goal is affecting my answer. I'm happy with an Andy Reid-like team. I'd prefer to be 10-6 most years and never win a SB than peak quickly with a SB and then spend years in the cellar.

For example, if I was the Phillies' GM I would have settled for one World Series. I would not have mortgaged the future to go after another. I would have built around Chase Utlley and let Ryan H go to an AL team. Of course Chase fizzled out too quickly but that was my opinion back then.

I don't like being in the cellar. I was probably psychologically damaged by growing up watching the Eagles fail to even have one winning team for ten years from the late 60's to the late 1970s.
samaroo
QUOTE (Eyrie @ Dec 5 2015, 04:14 AM) *
But would another GM have made all of those moves at the same time on a 10-6 team?

You can make a case for each individual move (even Mathis, despite the obvious lack of a replacement) but taken in aggregate there was a clear failing by our GM to look at the bigger picture.

Why does it matter that it was a 10-6 team? We weren't going to win it all. "Not content with contending." Remember that? That was us.
Eyrie
QUOTE (samaroo @ Dec 5 2015, 07:21 AM) *
Why does it matter that it was a 10-6 team? We weren't going to win it all. "Not content with contending." Remember that? That was us.

Because with back-to-back 10-6 teams you have a good team that can be added to, whereas Kelly took the decision to blow it all up and start from ground zero. That was a decision that should have been made when he took over from Reid and he'd have been given the time to see if he could make it work.

I gave Reid a lot of support for many years based on how he improved us with his changes in his first couple of years. It was only during his last couple of seasons that I decided he couldn't win the big one, so it was time for a change which I stated at the time was more likely to result in a change for the worse than for the better, but was worth making in a bid to break through.

I'd have been willing to give Kelly the same benefit if he'd made incremental changes, but too many of his personnel decisions have been poor and for an offensive coach to ignore the OL is unacceptable. I'm still willing to give him another year as the HC, but not as GM.

You don't reinforce failure.
Phits
QUOTE (Eyrie @ Dec 5 2015, 05:56 AM) *
...with back-to-back 10-6 teams you have a good team that can be added to...

We weren't very good last season. We had great special teams and that helped give the illusion that we were better than we were. We weren't a few tweaks from being a great team. This team needed a do over 2 seasons ago, but success prevented us from doing so. The problem is that winning double digit games, in a season, sets expectations much higher than they should be.

QUOTE
You don't reinforce failure.

In that case, wouldn't you replace the HC, and give the GM a chance to finish building the team?
Eyrie
QUOTE (Phits @ Dec 5 2015, 03:31 PM) *
We weren't very good last season. We had great special teams and that helped give the illusion that we were better than we were. We weren't a few tweaks from being a great team. This team needed a do over 2 seasons ago, but success prevented us from doing so. The problem is that winning double digit games, in a season, sets expectations much higher than they should be.


In that case, wouldn't you replace the HC, and give the GM a chance to finish building the team?

I'm of the opinion that Kelly is a good coach (hence our 10-6 record last year) but a poor GM based on the evidence, so his failure is in the GM role.
Reality Fan
QUOTE (Eyrie @ Dec 5 2015, 11:16 AM) *
I'm of the opinion that Kelly is a good coach (hence our 10-6 record last year) but a poor GM based on the evidence, so his failure is in the GM role.


based on less than 1 year?

It is akin of expecting a failed business plan to reverse fortune in one fiscal quarter.....it takes time to rebuild...I was overly optimistic about the fortunes of this team but the realistic side of me looks at the big picture.....the team, as it was built was not going to win anything.....while I think his ignoring the O line was a big mistake, the rest of the moves were prudent for the big picture. I believe it takes more than 1 offseason to evaluate a GM.
Phits
QUOTE (Eyrie @ Dec 5 2015, 11:16 AM) *
I'm of the opinion that Kelly is a good coach (hence our 10-6 record last year) but a poor GM based on the evidence, so his failure is in the GM role.

I think that's my problem with the evaluation (which seems to be a general consensus throughout Eagle-land). There isn't conclusive evidence that he is a poor GM, because there isn't enough. If you are going to evaluate him as a GM you would certainly need a longer period than a single off-season. If Lurie had hired a new GM (from outside the organization), it would be a ridiculous notion to fire him after a single off-season. In essence that is what we have done with Chip.

IMO, if we have to identify a single point of failure it has been in coaching, which is (supposed to be) Chip's strong suit. The difference between this season and last season is that the lucky breaks went our way. We haven't shown any on-field improvement, in regards to performance, from last season
nephillymike
QUOTE (samaroo @ Dec 5 2015, 02:21 AM) *
Why does it matter that it was a 10-6 team? We weren't going to win it all. "Not content with contending." Remember that? That was us.



I think people don't remember from where the teams that "win it all" come from.


Especially, if you think a team that gets to the SB has a decent chance to win it, which is valid given that most under dogs WIN the SB when they get there.

When you get a chance, look at where the teams that get to the SB were a year or two before.

It's not as tough as many think.
nephillymike
QUOTE (Reality Fan @ Dec 5 2015, 11:31 AM) *
based on less than 1 year?

It is akin of expecting a failed business plan to reverse fortune in one fiscal quarter.....it takes time to rebuild...I was overly optimistic about the fortunes of this team but the realistic side of me looks at the big picture.....the team, as it was built was not going to win anything.....while I think his ignoring the O line was a big mistake, the rest of the moves were prudent for the big picture. I believe it takes more than 1 offseason to evaluate a GM.



See my reply to sammy about where teams come from.
nephillymike
QUOTE (Phits @ Dec 5 2015, 12:00 PM) *
I think that's my problem with the evaluation (which seems to be a general consensus throughout Eagle-land). There isn't conclusive evidence that he is a poor GM, because there isn't enough. If you are going to evaluate him as a GM you would certainly need a longer period than a single off-season. If Lurie had hired a new GM (from outside the organization), it would be a ridiculous notion to fire him after a single off-season. In essence that is what we have done with Chip.

IMO, if we have to identify a single point of failure it has been in coaching, which is (supposed to be) Chip's strong suit. The difference between this season and last season is that the lucky breaks went our way. We haven't shown any on-field improvement, in regards to performance, from last season


When you "GM the talent" out of town and don't find good replacements, you screw the coach by giving him a lock of talent and make it nearly impossible for him to succeed.

Maclin makes many of our WR problems go away.

Mathis greatly improves our OL, starting and also depth.

Shady and the remaining guarantee that he had on his contract is worth way more than Alonzo and the money we guaranteed for Murray's performance. take that extra dough and buy I don't maybe another WR or OLman?

Seems he was right on Foles. Wrong on Bradford
Seems he was right on Boykin wrong on whomever

Not sure about Cole and his $ vs. Graham and his $.
Is Herremans better depth or starter than Chim Chim and Spridle?
mcnabbulous
QUOTE (nephillymike @ Dec 5 2015, 04:32 PM) *
When you "GM the talent" out of town and don't find good replacements, you screw the coach by giving him a lock of talent and make it nearly impossible for him to succeed.

Maclin makes many of our WR problems go away.

It's a shame he didn't want to play here anymore.

QUOTE
Mathis greatly improves our OL, starting and also depth.

It's a shame our all world LT didn't really seem to want him back.

QUOTE
Shady and the remaining guarantee that he had on his contract is worth way more than Alonzo and the money we guaranteed for Murray's performance. take that extra dough and buy I don't maybe another WR or OLman?

Which WR and OL do you have in mind? Moving on from Shady made sense. The Murray signing never really did, admittedly.

QUOTE
Seems he was right on Foles. Wrong on Bradford
Seems he was right on Boykin wrong on whomever

If he was right on Foles (he was) than the Bradford move made sense. It is impossible to deny that this team was better than Bradford than they have been with Sanchez. Bradford hasn't been great, but seeing where we are without him makes me think he has been better than we have given him credit for.

Giving up a 2 for him was a worthwhile gamble.

QUOTE
Not sure about Cole and his $ vs. Graham and his $.
Is Herremans better depth or starter than Chim Chim and Spridle?

None of these guys move the needle.
nephillymike
QUOTE (mcnabbulous @ Dec 5 2015, 10:19 PM) *
It's a shame he didn't want to play here anymore.


It's a shame our all world LT didn't really seem to want him back.


It's a real shame we didn't out bid the cap strapped KC team for his services and it's a shame that our "system" doesn't make up for having WR's that fucking blow! I'm sure people person Chip made him feel real wanted as he addressed other needs in early FA and not returning the guys call in a reasonable time while he was deciding what to do. Chip was probably in his lab figuring out a way to tinker with his practice regimen to save that precious two minutes in the practice, I mean, training, schedule.

You will NEVER convince me that he didn't fuck this up BIG TIME. We could have owned the Chiefs. I know, I know. We didn't need the net cap savings this year by signing Maclin and not Miles and cutting Cooper. We have the comfort of having Miles Austin, Riley Cooper, Josh Huff and the extra money in the bank. Maclin is projected at 83 catches for 1122, despite having injuries. Cooper and Austin and Huff 69 for 1034. And even with our shitty QB play, he eclipses those projected numbers here by a lot.

As far as our all world OT and for that matter his "just as content with Mathis dismissal" OC, they be well advised be careful of what they wish for in the future. It was pitiful hearing Kelce cry about all of the changes on the OL and trying to do to much last week. And lately, it seems like Mathis isn't the only one the all world OT doesn't want back!
nephillymike
QUOTE (mcnabbulous @ Dec 5 2015, 10:19 PM) *
It's a shame he didn't want to play here anymore.


It's a shame our all world LT didn't really seem to want him back.


It's a real shame we didn't out bid the cap strapped KC team for his services and it's a shame that our "system" doesn't make up for having WR's that fucking blow! I'm sure people person Chip made him feel real wanted as he addressed other needs in early FA and not returning the guys call in a reasonable time while he was deciding what to do. Chip was probably in his lab figuring out a way to tinker with his practice regimen to save that precious two minutes in the practice, I mean, training, schedule.

You will NEVER convince me that he didn't fuck this up BIG TIME. We could have owned the Chiefs. I know, I know. We didn't need the net cap savings this year by signing Maclin and not Miles and cutting Cooper. We have the comfort of having Miles Austin, Riley Cooper, Josh Huff and the extra money in the bank. Maclin is projected at 83 catches for 1122, despite having injuries. Cooper and Austin and Huff 69 for 1034. And even with our shitty QB play, he eclipses those projected numbers here by a lot.

As far as our all world OT and for that matter his "just as content with Mathis dismissal" OC, they be well advised be careful of what they wish for in the future. It was pitiful hearing Kelce cry about all of the changes on the OL and trying to do too much last week. And lately, it seems like Mathis isn't the only one the all world OT doesn't want back!
Phits
Do you think that any combination of Mathis/Cole/Maclin would have made us a SB contender this season? Assuming that's the goal, what would have been the long term benefit of holding onto them for another year?

I wish we could have re-signed Maclin, but he wanted to play elsewhere and he got his wish. You continually suggest that we could have outbid KC for Maclin's services....that's assuming that $$ was the only factor in his decision to move on and play elsewhere.

QUOTE (nephillymike @ Dec 5 2015, 11:31 PM) *
It's a real shame we didn't out bid the cap strapped KC team for his services and it's a shame that our "system" doesn't make up for having WR's that fucking blow! I'm sure people person Chip made him feel real wanted as he addressed other needs in early FA and not returning the guys call in a reasonable time while he was deciding what to do. Chip was probably in his lab figuring out a way to tinker with his practice regimen to save that precious two minutes in the practice, I mean, training, schedule.

You will NEVER convince me that he didn't fuck this up BIG TIME. We could have owned the Chiefs. I know, I know. We didn't need the net cap savings this year by signing Maclin and not Miles and cutting Cooper. We have the comfort of having Miles Austin, Riley Cooper, Josh Huff and the extra money in the bank. Maclin is projected at 83 catches for 1122, despite having injuries. Cooper and Austin and Huff 69 for 1034. And even with our shitty QB play, he eclipses those projected numbers here by a lot.

As far as our all world OT and for that matter his "just as content with Mathis dismissal" OC, they be well advised be careful of what they wish for in the future. It was pitiful hearing Kelce cry about all of the changes on the OL and trying to do too much last week. And lately, it seems like Mathis isn't the only one the all world OT doesn't want back!
Eyrie
Mikey's point about Maclin is that there was more than just the money. Reid was regularly on the phone emphasising how much he wanted his former player, whilst Kelly's approach was that a fair offer had been made. Maybe if Kelly had taken the time to talk more with Maclin about his role on this team and how good a fit the player was for the scheme then that may have helped. Or maybe not, but no reason not to try.

And the key point about Mathis was that we had him under contract but did not have a replacement ready when Kelly decided to cut him. If we'd signed a free agent or high draft pick to take his spot, then lost the player to injury after Mathis was released then we would have accepted it (as happened when Shepherd went down the day after we traded Boykin).

I'd have liked Cole for another year, but his contract had run out and so a decision had to be made on whether to offer him two years or let him go.

It was the right time to replace the declining Herremans, so letting him go was the right decision and that just emphasises my year long complaint about the absolute failure to address the OL. We needed a good FA and a mid-round pick at G to replace Herremans in 2015 and Mathis in 2016, yet our GM completely ignored the need despite having an offensive background. We're in a sorry state when a Scot knows more about building a roster than the GM.
Zero
QUOTE (nephillymike @ Dec 5 2015, 11:31 PM) *
As far as our all world OT and for that matter his "just as content with Mathis dismissal" OC, they be well advised be careful of what they wish for in the future. It was pitiful hearing Kelce cry about all of the changes on the OL and trying to do too much last week. And lately, it seems like Mathis isn't the only one the all world OT doesn't want back!
Not sure what you're talking about here. I've obviously missed news.
nephillymike
QUOTE (Phits @ Dec 6 2015, 01:15 AM) *
Do you think that any combination of Mathis/Cole/Maclin would have made us a SB contender this season? Assuming that's the goal, what would have been the long term benefit of holding onto them for another year?

I wish we could have re-signed Maclin, but he wanted to play elsewhere and he got his wish. You continually suggest that we could have outbid KC for Maclin's services....that's assuming that $$ was the only factor in his decision to move on and play elsewhere.



The way to be a Super Bowl contender, IMO, is to make it to the final four teams of your conference and let the chips fall where they may.

Yes, with Maclin and Mathis think we are worlds better than we are now. And with McCoy, we actually would have a guy who is a better fit for our "actual" blocking scheme as opposed to our "desired" blocking schemes and we would have saved millions in guaranteed money besides. Cole not so much as he has struggled but we can see that Twitter Bug Graham has under performed too.

Look how close we were to winning, what four games, by a kick? Maclin and Mathis upgrade significantly to the major issues for our demise. When you upgrade poor with very good, it solves a lot of issues. Who knows, with Maclin, maybe Bradford/Sanchez look good enough to keep around and possibly offer a viable shot going forward. Maybe having Maclin and Matthews out there, make the coverage shift ever so slightly to give the kid or Huff better looks, or Ertz more room in the middle with an occupied safety, or God forbid, the threat of a downfield WR pressence? Maybe Mathis offers comfort to his struggling former line mates to his left and right, while Barbre does an improved job over Chim Chim and Spritle at RG?

Those two could easily tilt the ATL, MIA and WAS game our way. 7-4 looks a lot better than 4-7. Put the McCoy/Mathews tandem instead of Murray/Mathews and better yet. You see with Mathews success and Murray's struggles, just how much the ability to make defenders miss on the second level is important to us, not to mention escapability when the OL screws up.

Chip the GM screwed this season. We had to wait years for Andy to finally realize that talent outperforms scheme. He had the luxury of Jim Johnson and a bunch of defensive talent left over to tide us over and a QB who did the same. Chip the coach doesn't have those safety valves. Unless the effort and results change dramatically, he's a dead man walking.
nephillymike
QUOTE (Zero @ Dec 6 2015, 07:00 AM) *
Not sure what you're talking about here. I've obviously missed news.



The all world OT gave a significantly less than ringing endorsement of Kelly last week. Said something like whetehr Chip is here or gone, he plays for Mr Lurie ans Mr Lurie is the one who brought him here and he is the one who signs his checks. This came after he declined to come off the bench a few weeks ago and went from active to inactive.

Kelce, like Peters, was fine with Mathis leaving, fully guzzling the scheme mantra. Then last week, he comes on the radio saying his play was poor and that he was trying to do too much and how it's tough when you have news guys in there with you and he forgot how comfortable it was playing next to the same guys all those years.

You gotta give both of them credit for speaking their mind in both instances.

Then we see Mathis on Sunday, and hear them say how he is one of the best run blockers and I'm like shit, I know a team that likes to run the ball that could use a run blocker!!

Whatever. Dead horse meet whip.

The impact of Chip's culture, GM ship and coaching the rest of the year will determine if he sinks or swims. For all of Andy's flaws, except for that last year, the team played hard for him. Sure JJ being up the D's ass when they fucked up had a lot to do with that, but Andy got the boys to play hard. Chip's players did not do that last year, and through a few games of adversity this year, have reacted like a bunch of twitter following Tin Men cry babies.

A win today goes miles in the right direction.

One can hope that the line is telling us the team has heart and the captain has a clue.
Reality Fan
QUOTE (nephillymike @ Dec 6 2015, 09:51 AM) *
For all of Andy's flaws, except for that last year, the team played hard for him. Sure JJ being up the D's ass when they fucked up had a lot to do with that, but Andy got the boys to play hard.


Did 2005 not happen?
Phits
QUOTE (nephillymike @ Dec 6 2015, 08:24 AM) *
The way to be a Super Bowl contender, IMO, is to make it to the final four teams of your conference and let the chips fall where they may.

Sounds like the Andy Reid approach. In the end we all clamoured for a SB and not just representing the final four or another 10 win season.

QUOTE
Yes, with Maclin and Mathis think we are worlds better than we are now. And with McCoy, we actually would have a guy who is a better fit for our "actual" blocking scheme as opposed to our "desired" blocking schemes and we would have saved millions in guaranteed money besides. Cole not so much as he has struggled but we can see that Twitter Bug Graham has under performed too.

Imagine it's the off-season and your future HoF LT fails to endorse one of the offensive guards (Mathis) content with running their mouth. In fact, your best lineman, says that you are better off without that particular guard....the same guard that you were shopping without any takers.

QUOTE
Look how close we were to winning, what four games, by a kick? Maclin and Mathis upgrade significantly to the major issues for our demise. When you upgrade poor with very good, it solves a lot of issues. Who knows, with Maclin, maybe Bradford/Sanchez look good enough to keep around and possibly offer a viable shot going forward. Maybe having Maclin and Matthews out there, make the coverage shift ever so slightly to give the kid or Huff better looks, or Ertz more room in the middle with an occupied safety, or God forbid, the threat of a downfield WR pressence? Maybe Mathis offers comfort to his struggling former line mates to his left and right, while Barbre does an improved job over Chim Chim and Spritle at RG?

Those two could easily tilt the ATL, MIA and WAS game our way. 7-4 looks a lot better than 4-7. Put the McCoy/Mathews tandem instead of Murray/Mathews and better yet. You see with Mathews success and Murray's struggles, just how much the ability to make defenders miss on the second level is important to us, not to mention escapability when the OL screws up.

The cause and effect would have different factors affecting the outcome. Suggesting McCoy would have more value in this offense, this year, is hyperbole. The backs that replaced him have (collectively) out produced him this season. And that's with our new feature back having an off-season.

Maclin chose to go somewhere else. It is your opinion that if Chip had courted him the way Andy did he would still be here. There is no basis for that argument. Maclin had offers and made a decision. Even more interesting is that outside of a few monster games this season, Maclin has been very average. Whereas our current #1 (Matthews) is having an off-season and has (almost) equal production.

QUOTE
Chip the GM screwed this season. We had to wait years for Andy to finally realize that talent outperforms scheme. He had the luxury of Jim Johnson and a bunch of defensive talent left over to tide us over and a QB who did the same. Chip the coach doesn't have those safety valves.

Talent does not out trump scheme...we learned that with the "Dream Team". However, you can't neglect talent. For example; Thrash, Smalls and Pinkston weren't going to get it done. GM's and coaches put value in certain positions and will spend accordingly.

QUOTE
Unless the effort and results change dramatically, he's a dead man walking.

There's almost zero chance that Lurie eats the balance of Chip's contract (near 20 million) because of one bad season, while the team is 're-tooling'. The only (real) chance Chip leaves this off-season is by choice.
Phits
QUOTE (Eyrie @ Dec 6 2015, 06:22 AM) *
Mikey's point about Maclin is that there was more than just the money. Reid was regularly on the phone emphasising how much he wanted his former player, whilst Kelly's approach was that a fair offer had been made. Maybe if Kelly had taken the time to talk more with Maclin about his role on this team and how good a fit the player was for the scheme then that may have helped. Or maybe not, but no reason not to try.

We don't know the extent of what efforts were made. Maclin said his first choice was to re-sign with Philly. If this is the perceived sentiment how much further do you go after making an extremely fair offer? Reid was able to poach our FA, because he drafted him and knew what buttons to press.

QUOTE
And the key point about Mathis was that we had him under contract but did not have a replacement ready when Kelly decided to cut him.

Based on the rumors, Mathis was being insubordinate. You can't have a guard undermining your authority.

QUOTE
It was the right time to replace the declining Herremans, so letting him go was the right decision and that just emphasises my year long complaint about the absolute failure to address the OL. We needed a good FA and a mid-round pick at G to replace Herremans in 2015 and Mathis in 2016, yet our GM completely ignored the need despite having an offensive background. We're in a sorry state when a Scot knows more about building a roster than the GM.

Perhaps the GM felt that the talent level was as good as anything that was out there.

My point with all of this is that you need to allow time for the vision. A single off-season tells us nothing. At minimum Chip should have another season. Ideally, he would have the 3.2 years that is usually necessary for a GM to help turn over a roster to suit his vision. Some of the moves are head scratchers and I probably would not have done them myself, but I don't have a reputation and a job riding on these decisions.
nephillymike
QUOTE (Phits @ Dec 6 2015, 12:05 PM) *
Sounds like the Andy Reid approach. In the end we all clamoured for a SB and not just representing the final four or another 10 win season.


Imagine it's the off-season and your future HoF LT fails to endorse one of the offensive guards (Mathis) content with running their mouth. In fact, your best lineman, says that you are better off without that particular guard....the same guard that you were shopping without any takers.


The cause and effect would have different factors affecting the outcome. Suggesting McCoy would have more value in this offense, this year, is hyperbole. The backs that replaced him have (collectively) out produced him this season. And that's with our new feature back having an off-season.

Maclin chose to go somewhere else. It is your opinion that if Chip had courted him the way Andy did he would still be here. There is no basis for that argument. Maclin had offers and made a decision. Even more interesting is that outside of a few monster games this season, Maclin has been very average. Whereas our current #1 (Matthews) is having an off-season and has (almost) equal production.


Talent does not out trump scheme...we learned that with the "Dream Team". However, you can't neglect talent. For example; Thrash, Smalls and Pinkston weren't going to get it done. GM's and coaches put value in certain positions and will spend accordingly.


There's almost zero chance that Lurie eats the balance of Chip's contract (near 20 million) because of one bad season, while the team is 're-tooling'. The only (real) chance Chip leaves this off-season is by choice.


If there isn't a basis for Maclin staying by courtship, there is one by him staying by us beating the KC offer. That extra money for us was nothing compared to KC's commitment.

Do you REALLY think that if Chip had a crystal ball and could see how bad his choices are at WR's in Maclin's absence, that he wouldn't have out bid KC and Maclin would still be here? Hindsight or whatever, these are his choices.

Same thing to a lesser extent with Mathis.

He blew it.
nephillymike
QUOTE (Reality Fan @ Dec 6 2015, 11:51 AM) *
Did 2005 not happen?



Not in my mind after all of those therapy sessions.

What is this 2005 you speak of?
Phits
QUOTE (nephillymike @ Dec 6 2015, 12:27 PM) *
If there isn't a basis for Maclin staying by courtship, there is one by him staying by us beating the KC offer. That extra money for us was nothing compared to KC's commitment.

Do you REALLY think that if Chip had a crystal ball and could see how bad his choices are at WR's in Maclin's absence, that he wouldn't have out bid KC and Maclin would still be here? Hindsight or whatever, these are his choices.

Same thing to a lesser extent with Mathis.

He blew it.

Check Maclin's numbers for the season. I love Mac, but he's not an elite receiver. He's a good receiver. Let's not make him out to be a game changer.
JeeQ
QUOTE
Report: Eagles won’t fire Chip Kelly after the season

On Sunday, a report from Jason La Canfora emerged echoing something Peter King said on last Sunday’s edition of NBC’s Football Night in America: The Eagles won’t fire coach Chip Kelly after the season.

La Canfora this week, and King last week, also expressed a belief that Kelly won’t leave to return to the college ranks.

There’s no reason to believe either item is inaccurate. However, there’s one significant wild card not mentioned in La Canfora’s online story about Kelly and the Eagles. If the Titans call the Eagles and inquire about hiring Kelly, the dynamics could change, quickly and dramatically.

If the Eagles do anything other than hang up the phone, the door swings open for a deal possibly being down between the two teams — and then between the Titans and Kelly. Since the Titans wouldn’t have permission to talk to Kelly until the Titans and the Eagles work out specific compensation for Kelly’s services, Kelly already would know that the Eagles are willing to let him go before negotiating with the Titans the terms of his departure.

It’s entirely possible that Kelly will make it known through the back channels that the Titans shouldn’t bother to even call. It’s also possible the Titans have no intent to call the Eagles. Regardless, with plenty of reports being published about Kelly’s future with the Eagles, a possible reunion of Kelly with Titans quarterback Marcus Mariota continues to be the one thing about which there is no specific information, yet.
Reality Fan
QUOTE (nephillymike @ Dec 6 2015, 12:28 PM) *
Not in my mind after all of those therapy sessions.

What is this 2005 you speak of?



Well played...lol
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