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SAM I Am
Interesting article on Nick Foles play with quotes from him and OC Pat Shurmur.

Foles driving a high-powered machine, but he's still just a kid


nephillymike
QUOTE (SAM I Am @ Oct 8 2014, 09:04 PM) *
Interesting article on Nick Foles play with quotes from him and OC Pat Shurmur.

Foles driving a high-powered machine, but he's still just a kid



Good stuff, thanks.

I don't know.

Let's just have Foles light it up on Sunday and make all this talk silly.
koolaidluke
The article is bullshit.

First of all it harps big time on the isolated fact that the Eagles are 4-1. Great. Good for the Eagles. But the offense has put up an average of 21.4 points per game over those 5 games so it isn't like Foles is solely responsible for those wins.

Then it goes into the "he only in what is really his second year" thing. That's bullshit. He's in his 3rd year, period. He has been groomed to be a QB essentially since birth with private QB coaches his entire life and was a 4 year starter in college. Foles is a young player but he isn't some raw kid. He has room for improvement at the margins but basically what you see now is what you are going to get.

Next it talks about what we've heard endlessly this entire season, "he is missing starters on his offensive line!". Well I hate to break it to you, but most QBs don't get to operate in the greenhouse conditions that Foles did last season with 0 pressure, wide open receivers and a lethal running game. Also, despite missing starters the pass protection hasn't been that bad. The Eagles run a huge amount of quick receiver screens and Foles still averages 2.72 seconds to throw the ball and despite that has only been sacked once, so while the pass pro needs improvement it hasn't been 2012 bad or anywhere close to it. Hell, it hasn't been as bad as Eli has had to deal with for most of his career.

There are things that can be done to help Foles such as re-emergence of the running game, phasing out Celek in favor of Ertz, replacing Cooper with a real receiver and better pass pro but even all those things combined are not going to turn Foles into an elite QB. Foles is a good player and there is no reason he can't be the Eagles QB for the next decade but he's never going to be more than an Andy Dalton type.
Birdwatcher
QUOTE (koolaidluke @ Oct 8 2014, 11:07 PM) *
The article is bullshit.

First of all it harps big time on the isolated fact that the Eagles are 4-1. Great. Good for the Eagles. But the offense has put up an average of 21.4 points per game over those 5 games so it isn't like Foles is solely responsible for those wins.

Then it goes into the "he only in what is really his second year" thing. That's bullshit. He's in his 3rd year, period. He has been groomed to be a QB essentially since birth with private QB coaches his entire life and was a 4 year starter in college. Foles is a young player but he isn't some raw kid. He has room for improvement at the margins but basically what you see now is what you are going to get.

Next it talks about what we've heard endlessly this entire season, "he is missing starters on his offensive line!". Well I hate to break it to you, but most QBs don't get to operate in the greenhouse conditions that Foles did last season with 0 pressure, wide open receivers and a lethal running game. Also, despite missing starters the pass protection hasn't been that bad. The Eagles run a huge amount of quick receiver screens and Foles still averages 2.72 seconds to throw the ball and despite that has only been sacked once, so while the pass pro needs improvement it hasn't been 2012 bad or anywhere close to it. Hell, it hasn't been as bad as Eli has had to deal with for most of his career.

There are things that can be done to help Foles such as re-emergence of the running game, phasing out Celek in favor of Ertz, replacing Cooper with a real receiver and better pass pro but even all those things combined are not going to turn Foles into an elite QB. Foles is a good player and there is no reason he can't be the Eagles QB for the next decade but he's never going to be more than an Andy Dalton type.




Mike Schmidt once said, "Philadelphia is the only town where you can experience the thrill of victory and the agony of reading about it the next day."
Zero
What we will always hear from an Eagle fan is if ___________ is good enough to win a SB. That's the end story.
Wheeljack
QUOTE (koolaidluke @ Oct 8 2014, 11:07 PM) *
The article is bullshit.

First of all it harps big time on the isolated fact that the Eagles are 4-1. Great. Good for the Eagles. But the offense has put up an average of 21.4 points per game over those 5 games so it isn't like Foles is solely responsible for those wins.

Then it goes into the "he only in what is really his second year" thing. That's bullshit. He's in his 3rd year, period. He has been groomed to be a QB essentially since birth with private QB coaches his entire life and was a 4 year starter in college. Foles is a young player but he isn't some raw kid. He has room for improvement at the margins but basically what you see now is what you are going to get.

Next it talks about what we've heard endlessly this entire season, "he is missing starters on his offensive line!". Well I hate to break it to you, but most QBs don't get to operate in the greenhouse conditions that Foles did last season with 0 pressure, wide open receivers and a lethal running game. Also, despite missing starters the pass protection hasn't been that bad. The Eagles run a huge amount of quick receiver screens and Foles still averages 2.72 seconds to throw the ball and despite that has only been sacked once, so while the pass pro needs improvement it hasn't been 2012 bad or anywhere close to it. Hell, it hasn't been as bad as Eli has had to deal with for most of his career.

There are things that can be done to help Foles such as re-emergence of the running game, phasing out Celek in favor of Ertz, replacing Cooper with a real receiver and better pass pro but even all those things combined are not going to turn Foles into an elite QB. Foles is a good player and there is no reason he can't be the Eagles QB for the next decade but he's never going to be more than an Andy Dalton type.


BINGO.

I find it ironic that there is a good deal of silence from people who had everything to say when certain QBs were missing the mark as much as Foles is now...
Wheeljack
double posted.
make_it_rain
QUOTE (koolaidluke @ Oct 8 2014, 11:07 PM) *
The article is bullshit.

First of all it harps big time on the isolated fact that the Eagles are 4-1. Great. Good for the Eagles. But the offense has put up an average of 21.4 points per game over those 5 games so it isn't like Foles is solely responsible for those wins.

Then it goes into the "he only in what is really his second year" thing. That's bullshit. He's in his 3rd year, period. He has been groomed to be a QB essentially since birth with private QB coaches his entire life and was a 4 year starter in college. Foles is a young player but he isn't some raw kid. He has room for improvement at the margins but basically what you see now is what you are going to get.

Next it talks about what we've heard endlessly this entire season, "he is missing starters on his offensive line!". Well I hate to break it to you, but most QBs don't get to operate in the greenhouse conditions that Foles did last season with 0 pressure, wide open receivers and a lethal running game. Also, despite missing starters the pass protection hasn't been that bad. The Eagles run a huge amount of quick receiver screens and Foles still averages 2.72 seconds to throw the ball and despite that has only been sacked once, so while the pass pro needs improvement it hasn't been 2012 bad or anywhere close to it. Hell, it hasn't been as bad as Eli has had to deal with for most of his career.

There are things that can be done to help Foles such as re-emergence of the running game, phasing out Celek in favor of Ertz, replacing Cooper with a real receiver and better pass pro but even all those things combined are not going to turn Foles into an elite QB. Foles is a good player and there is no reason he can't be the Eagles QB for the next decade but he's never going to be more than an Andy Dalton type.


Eyrie
QUOTE (Wheeljack @ Oct 9 2014, 01:40 PM) *
BINGO.

I find it ironic that there is a good deal of silence from people who had everything to say when certain QBs were missing the mark as much as Foles is now...

Foles is playing poorly. It's early in his career so it is appropriate to wait to see if last season was the fluke with this season being the norm, or vice versa.

I'd be more concerned if we were starting Sanchez, since there is enough data that he isn't a top level QB.
mcnabbulous
QUOTE (Eyrie @ Oct 9 2014, 01:30 PM) *
I'd be more concerned if we were starting Sanchez, since there is enough data that he isn't a top level QB.

Sanchez was in arguably the worst offensive situation in football in NY. Some very special QB's can overcome that, but most guys would have suffered there.

I don't quite know what to think of him, but I don't think the dataset in NY proves anything about the guy. I think there is a very good chance he could become an above-average to good starter in the league, in the proper situation.
nephillymike
QUOTE (koolaidluke @ Oct 8 2014, 10:07 PM) *
The article is bullshit.

First of all it harps big time on the isolated fact that the Eagles are 4-1. Great. Good for the Eagles. But the offense has put up an average of 21.4 points per game over those 5 games so it isn't like Foles is solely responsible for those wins.

Then it goes into the "he only in what is really his second year" thing. That's bullshit. He's in his 3rd year, period. He has been groomed to be a QB essentially since birth with private QB coaches his entire life and was a 4 year starter in college. Foles is a young player but he isn't some raw kid. He has room for improvement at the margins but basically what you see now is what you are going to get.

Next it talks about what we've heard endlessly this entire season, "he is missing starters on his offensive line!". Well I hate to break it to you, but most QBs don't get to operate in the greenhouse conditions that Foles did last season with 0 pressure, wide open receivers and a lethal running game. Also, despite missing starters the pass protection hasn't been that bad. The Eagles run a huge amount of quick receiver screens and Foles still averages 2.72 seconds to throw the ball and despite that has only been sacked once, so while the pass pro needs improvement it hasn't been 2012 bad or anywhere close to it. Hell, it hasn't been as bad as Eli has had to deal with for most of his career.

There are things that can be done to help Foles such as re-emergence of the running game, phasing out Celek in favor of Ertz, replacing Cooper with a real receiver and better pass pro but even all those things combined are not going to turn Foles into an elite QB. Foles is a good player and there is no reason he can't be the Eagles QB for the next decade but he's never going to be more than an Andy Dalton type.

I agree with most of this but disagree that what we see now is what we will get. He's playing poorly now. He played as one of the best of all-time last year and he played like few rookies ever had two years ago in a completely different system. I think what he will be is a very good, top tenish QB, better than Dalton.

That being said, he needs to play better and he has three games to turn it around or I go to Sanchez.

We have games we need to win, and like it or not people, it will take at least 11 wins to win the East outright.
xsv
I'm not happy about the number of times he's turned the ball over this year. And I'm not happy with his accuracy this year either. That said, looking at his college career and his short time in the pros, these are generally two of his strengths.

I think he's just had a bad couple of games. I don't think he's trusted his line to keep his jersey clean, and he's taken a bit of a beating. Sure, he's tough, and he gets back up, but it's affected him.

If the line settles down, and we get a ground game going, I think over time it will even out. He's easily earned the rest of the season to try to get it right.
mcnabbulous
Foles deserves the full season. There doesn't seem like a whole lot of benefit in switching to Sanchez, under any circumstances. I can't think of too many in-season, performance based QB changes that resulted success. Dilfer in Baltimore and Kaepernick are the only two that come to mind.

I'm not really high on Foles and think we'll ultimately move in the direction of a more mobile solution, but we might as well ride this out.
Wheeljack
QUOTE (mcnabbulous @ Oct 9 2014, 03:00 PM) *
Sanchez was in arguably the worst offensive situation in football in NY. Some very special QB's can overcome that, but most guys would have suffered there.

I don't quite know what to think of him, but I don't think the dataset in NY proves anything about the guy. I think there is a very good chance he could become an above-average to good starter in the league, in the proper situation.


I agree. I mean, just check Favre w/the Jets and Favre the first year he got out of there... he had the most un-Favre season until the end of it
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