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SAM I Am
You don't have to answer this if you don't want to, but I was wondering which way you are leaning with regards to Thursday's vote for or against declaring independence from the UK, and why?

And which way are most of your fellow countrymen leaning as the day approaches?
Eyrie
As a proud Scot I have firm views on what is in the best interests of my country.

But I genuinely don't know what the outcome will be. The polls have closed up in recent weeks with Yes gaining ground to the extent that it is now too close to predict. The Better Together campaign has been lacklustre and complacent, allowing the Yes Scotland side to set their preferred question and only at the last minute coming out with promises of additional devolution. The Yes campaign on the other hand have been high profile and successfully built momentum going into the vote.

There's been a lack of genuine debate however, with the Yes side quick to duck awkward questions by claiming that these are anti-Scottish or scaremongering. Most of their appeal is based on emotion whilst the hard facts tend to favour the Better Together campaign.

I've carefully considered the issues and decided that we're not being offered proper independence, too much is dependent on post-vote negotiations, we're doing very well as part of the UK and the idea of living in a socialist utopia fills me with horror.
SAM I Am
QUOTE (Eyrie @ Sep 17 2014, 02:38 PM) *
As a proud Scot I have firm views on what is in the best interests of my country.

But I genuinely don't know what the outcome will be. The polls have closed up in recent weeks with Yes gaining ground to the extent that it is now too close to predict. The Better Together campaign has been lacklustre and complacent, allowing the Yes Scotland side to set their preferred question and only at the last minute coming out with promises of additional devolution. The Yes campaign on the other hand have been high profile and successfully built momentum going into the vote.

There's been a lack of genuine debate however, with the Yes side quick to duck awkward questions by claiming that these are anti-Scottish or scaremongering. Most of their appeal is based on emotion whilst the hard facts tend to favour the Better Together campaign.

I've carefully considered the issues and decided that we're not being offered proper independence, too much is dependent on post-vote negotiations, we're doing very well as part of the UK and the idea of living in a socialist utopia fills me with horror.

Interesting. I was under the impression that if the Yes camp came out on top, it would mean a complete break --- independence --- from the UK. Maybe I am just not understanding what you mean by "proper" independence.

I do know this much, if the Yes camp does come out on top, there are going to be quite a few ramifications that will not only obviously affect Scotland, but will have a ripple effect throughout all of Europe, and then some.

I also found it interesting that 16 and 17 year-olds will be able to vote on the referendum.

According to the latest poll I saw, the Better Together camp has a slight lead, if that is worth anything.

I'll be watching tomorrow. Good Luck.
HOUSEoPAIN
QUOTE (Eyrie @ Sep 17 2014, 02:38 PM) *
Most of their appeal is based on emotion whilst the hard facts tend to favour the Better Together campaign.


Such goes every election cycle.
Eyrie
QUOTE (SAM I Am @ Sep 18 2014, 12:15 AM) *
Interesting. I was under the impression that if the Yes camp came out on top, it would mean a complete break --- independence --- from the UK. Maybe I am just not understanding what you mean by "proper" independence.

In theory yes, but the deal we're being offered is full of compromises.

The key one is that the Yes campaign are demanding that we continue to share the pound sterling with the remaining UK after independence. The problem with that is the rUK economy will be ten times our size and so interest rates will be set to suit them, not us. What makes this a particular problem is that we are being promised that we can have our own centre left governments whilst rUK suffers perpetual right wing Tory governments, so effectively our economy will be controlled by a government pursuing very different objectives and which we will be unable to change. As a Tory I don't find this a problem but it does call into question our "independence".

What makes it more interesting is that the main UK parties and opinion polls in rUK have made it clear that they are not interested in a shared currency, leading to a threat from the Yes campaign that an independent Scotland won't accept a share of the current UK debt. Given that part of this debt has been incurred providing services and constructing assets in Scotland, it is morally indefensible as well as disastrous since no-one will lend to Scotland except at a hefty premium. Fortunately the punchline is that Scotland would have to apply to join the EU and I'd expect rUK to veto our membership until our politicians accept responsibility for a fair share of the debt.

QUOTE
I do know this much, if the Yes camp does come out on top, there are going to be quite a few ramifications that will not only obviously affect Scotland, but will have a ripple effect throughout all of Europe, and then some.

Spain and Belgium come to mind, but there will be others.

QUOTE
I also found it interesting that 16 and 17 year-olds will be able to vote on the referendum.

It's the only time that has happened in, and is allegedly because they're expected to prefer Yes.

QUOTE
According to the latest poll I saw, the Better Together camp has a slight lead, if that is worth anything.

I'll be watching tomorrow. Good Luck.


I hope so, and thanks.
Eyrie
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SAM I Am
QUOTE (Eyrie @ Sep 19 2014, 01:56 PM) *
biggrin.gif

Congrats!!!

Looks like even with the "Better Together" 55% - 45% victory, there will be some fallout, but I am sure that was to be expected.

Now the question is, will the Birds win a SB before this comes up again for another vote, quite a few years down the line I am sure, if at all?
Eyrie
QUOTE (SAM I Am @ Sep 19 2014, 10:20 PM) *
Congrats!!!

Looks like even with the "Better Together" 55% - 45% victory, there will be some fallout, but I am sure that was to be expected.

Now the question is, will the Birds win a SB before this comes up again for another vote, quite a few years down the line I am sure, if at all?

I'd be surprised if there isn't another attempt in 15-20 years, or sooner if the pledge of additional powers isn't properly followed through.

But I'd far rather we win the SuperBowl a few times before that happens. Fuck it - I'd settle for just once.
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