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koolaidluke
Foles always kinda gave me a bad vibe. Not that he was a bad QB but I always had this feeling with him that he wouldn't be able to handle the pounding. It certainly seems now that that is the case.

I really like what I've seen so far from Barkley. He throws the ball well and just seems to have "it". I know that is cliche but evaluating a young QB is more of an art than a science.

Let's see what Barkley can do with more playing time and practice reps. I think the Eagles O can improve to at least mediocrity by the end of the season which isn't that bad considering it's year 1 with a rookie QB (assuming Barkley keeps the starting job).
mcnabbulous
I like him more than Foles, but I've been pretty bewildered by his lack of common sense on the field. I expected a bit more out of him in that regard, given the fact that he's been a starting QB since he exited the womb.
TGryn
We'll know he's progressed when he starts throwing the ball away. On plays like this one, he needs to just dump it into the sidelines after he dodges the first guy if there's nothing immediately open.


I think he's trying to "make things happen" too much, which he probably needed to do at USC his final year because the rest of the offense wasn't as talented as previous years.

Another thing is that the QB "clock" of how long you typically have to scan the field is different from the NFL than college, and the window of how open a guy is and how long is a lot shorter. Both are things every rookie has to adjust to; the first results in sacks and fumbles, the second in INTs, until that adjustment gets made.
Dreagon
I'm not sure he's the answer, but I think he has the best chance of being the answer. Let's face it, Vick is on his way out, and Foles is going to make an excellent backup. But neither of them is the "answer". Now there are a couple of franchise potential QB's in the upcoming draft, and honestly you guys need to see what you have in Barkley before next April because you might have a legitimate shot at one of them.
Zero
QUOTE (Dreagon @ Oct 28 2013, 10:49 PM) *
Now there are a couple of franchise potential QB's in the upcoming draft, and honestly you guys ... might have a legitimate shot at one of them.

This is both depressing and exciting. mad.gif biggrin.gif wacko.gif
koolaidluke
QUOTE (Dreagon @ Oct 28 2013, 10:49 PM) *
Foles is going to make an excellent backup.


Foles would be a pro bowler if he could stay healthy. I don't think he'll be able to.

I have no interest in an injury prone backup. A backup better be durable.
Jax
QUOTE (mcnabbulous @ Oct 28 2013, 06:43 PM) *
I like him more than Foles, but I've been pretty bewildered by his lack of common sense on the field. I expected a bit more out of him in that regard, given the fact that he's been a starting QB since he exited the womb.

Are you a Trojan Alum? I'm not sure how you and Luke have watched Barkley and see him as a better NFL QB than Foles. The only negative thus far to Foles is that he got tight and choked against one of our big rivals in an important game. BUT, he made the reads and the plays just pushed the throws. It's not like he got a brain cramp and couldn't make decisions like Vick and Barkley. Foles made the right decisions against Dallas but was tight and couldn't make easy throws. That is easier to overcome than not being able to read progressions and make decisions in a timely manner. Vick has no internal clock. Barkley doesn't appear to be a high Football IQ quarterback either.
Jax
QUOTE (Dreagon @ Oct 28 2013, 10:49 PM) *
I'm not sure he's the answer, but I think he has the best chance of being the answer. Let's face it, Vick is on his way out, and Foles is going to make an excellent backup. But neither of them is the "answer". Now there are a couple of franchise potential QB's in the upcoming draft, and honestly you guys need to see what you have in Barkley before next April because you might have a legitimate shot at one of them.

Barkley is an emergency player at this point with an upside of being a backup. Foles could be a good backup but maybe not more than that in Chip's offense. I don't think injury-prone can be concluded after one concussion. In a different offense I think Foles could be good.


If Foles plays this week I will be interested to see if he looks more like the guy missing every pass against Dallas or more like the QB in his prior action.
mcnabbulous
QUOTE (Jax @ Oct 30 2013, 08:23 AM) *
Are you a Trojan Alum?

No. I actually actively dislike USC.

QUOTE
I'm not sure how you and Luke have watched Barkley and see him as a better NFL QB than Foles.

Right now, I don't like either of them. I simply don't like the way Foles throws the ball. That has been the case since day 1.

QUOTE
The only negative thus far to Foles is that he got tight and choked against one of our big rivals in an important game. BUT, he made the reads and the plays just pushed the throws.

He missed a lot of reads and was holding the ball way too long. Missing the throws was one of many problems.

He has two wins in his career. Both against the Bucs. Consider me unimpressed. I'm not sure why you think he's anything more than a marginal player.

QUOTE
It's not like he got a brain cramp and couldn't make decisions like Vick and Barkley.

Barkley hasn't been given a shot to run with the ones. He said himself that he had actually never run the play that he fumbled on. Just watched the other guys in practice.

QUOTE
Foles made the right decisions against Dallas but was tight and couldn't make easy throws.

Once again, this simply isn't true. I can point you in the direction of some all-22 action if you haven't seen it already.

QUOTE
That is easier to overcome than not being able to read progressions and make decisions in a timely manner. Vick has no internal clock. Barkley doesn't appear to be a high Football IQ quarterback either.

Vick isn't a good QB, but his intangibles make him a better player than Foles. Especially for this offense.

Barkely's football IQ is the least of my concerns. He's a rookie and he's playing like it. If need be, I can list off a handful of successful NFL QB's who struggled dramatically as rookies. A guy that's leading the only undefeated team in football started his career with 1 TD and 11 INTs.
Jax
QUOTE (mcnabbulous @ Oct 30 2013, 10:21 AM) *
No. I actually actively dislike USC.


Right now, I don't like either of them. I simply don't like the way Foles throws the ball. That has been the case since day 1.


He missed a lot of reads and was holding the ball way too long. Missing the throws was one of many problems.

He has two wins in his career. Both against the Bucs. Consider me unimpressed. I'm not sure why you think he's anything more than a marginal player.


Barkley hasn't been given a shot to run with the ones. He said himself that he had actually never run the play that he fumbled on. Just watched the other guys in practice.


Once again, this simply isn't true. I can point you in the direction of some all-22 action if you haven't seen it already.


Vick isn't a good QB, but his intangibles make him a better player than Foles. Especially for this offense.

Barkely's football IQ is the least of my concerns. He's a rookie and he's playing like it. If need be, I can list off a handful of successful NFL QB's who struggled dramatically as rookies. A guy that's leading the only undefeated team in football started his career with 1 TD and 11 INTs.


I look forward to watching this Sunday afternoon.
Jax
QUOTE (mcnabbulous @ Oct 28 2013, 06:43 PM) *
I like him more than Foles, but I've been pretty bewildered by his lack of common sense on the field. I expected a bit more out of him in that regard, given the fact that he's been a starting QB since he exited the womb.

Really?
Jax
QUOTE (mcnabbulous @ Oct 30 2013, 10:21 AM) *
No. I actually actively dislike USC.


Right now, I don't like either of them. I simply don't like the way Foles throws the ball. That has been the case since day 1.


He missed a lot of reads and was holding the ball way too long. Missing the throws was one of many problems.

He has two wins in his career. Both against the Bucs. Consider me unimpressed. I'm not sure why you think he's anything more than a marginal player.


Barkley hasn't been given a shot to run with the ones. He said himself that he had actually never run the play that he fumbled on. Just watched the other guys in practice.


Once again, this simply isn't true. I can point you in the direction of some all-22 action if you haven't seen it already.


Vick isn't a good QB, but his intangibles make him a better player than Foles. Especially for this offense.

Barkely's football IQ is the least of my concerns. He's a rookie and he's playing like it. If need be, I can list off a handful of successful NFL QB's who struggled dramatically as rookies. A guy that's leading the only undefeated team in football started his career with 1 TD and 11 INTs.


Yeah?
Jax
QUOTE (Jax @ Oct 30 2013, 10:47 AM) *
I look forward to watching this Sunday afternoon.

wink.gif
mcnabbulous
QUOTE (Jax @ Nov 4 2013, 07:51 PM) *
Yeah?

Hopefully this will come back to be my worst post of all time. After the Dallas game, I was pretty discouraged by Foles. I have to believe he was hurt, but that still doesn't explain how inexplicably bad he was in that game.

He was so good throwing the ball down the field yesterday that I'm hoping he has turned the corner in that regard. It was my biggest question mark about his game. The short and intermediate stuff has been pretty good (other than against Dallas.)

Big test this week. I'm excited to see what he does as an encore.
Jax
QUOTE (mcnabbulous @ Nov 4 2013, 08:58 PM) *
Hopefully this will come back to be my worst post of all time. After the Dallas game, I was pretty discouraged by Foles. I have to believe he was hurt, but that still doesn't explain how inexplicably bad he was in that game.

He was so good throwing the ball down the field yesterday that I'm hoping he has turned the corner in that regard. It was my biggest question mark about his game. The short and intermediate stuff has been pretty good (other than against Dallas.)

Big test this week. I'm excited to see what he does as an encore.

True, I just had to give you a little ribbing wink.gif
Jax
QUOTE (mcnabbulous @ Nov 4 2013, 08:58 PM) *
Hopefully this will come back to be my worst post of all time. After the Dallas game, I was pretty discouraged by Foles. I have to believe he was hurt, but that still doesn't explain how inexplicably bad he was in that game.

He was so good throwing the ball down the field yesterday that I'm hoping he has turned the corner in that regard. It was my biggest question mark about his game. The short and intermediate stuff has been pretty good (other than against Dallas.)

Big test this week. I'm excited to see what he does as an encore.

I've never thought throwing the ball down field was a problem. Regarding the Dallas game, there may have been injury issues but I think he was just tight and locked up. Hopefully he can grow from that.
Zero
QUOTE (Jax @ Nov 4 2013, 09:27 PM) *
Regarding the Dallas game, there may have been injury issues but I think he was just tight and locked up.

That's a scary thought.
mcnabbulous
QUOTE (Jax @ Nov 4 2013, 08:25 PM) *
True, I just had to give you a little ribbing wink.gif


Well deserved. I still think Barkley can be something, but it's clear that Foles can play. Throwing the deep ball is a learned skill. One of the few that can be improved upon greatly at that position. His pocket presence is fantastic and his overall accuracy is good enough.
I prefer to think it was injury against Dallas than your scenario. Either way, I'd love nothing more than to see this Austinite become our next superstar.
Zero
QUOTE (mcnabbulous @ Nov 4 2013, 10:23 PM) *
I'd love nothing more than to see this Austinite become our next superstar.

Interesting choice of words. Not "love", not "next" and not "superstar." I realize he's from Austin but I'm curious if there was a reason you used that descriptor there.
Zero
Add this to the Foles query:
QUOTE
Top 2013 red zone QB passer ratings: 1. Peyton Manning 128.0, 2. Nick Foles 119.2, 3. Aaron Rodgers 115.5.
This way ....
Zero
Same link:
QUOTE
Nick Foles has the same amount of TD passes (13) as Cam Newton, Andrew Luck and Tom Brady. Nick doesn't have half as many attempts as them.


It's the damn Dallas game that's got me leery. How could he play that bad?
Zero
Yet, there's really so much to like about him. He's not the brash, arrogant, camera-loving super star personality, he's had a string of impressive stats since he came into the NFL. He has a reputation for being tough, and now this:
QUOTE
ďI donít play sports for myself. I never did. When I think of my favorite memories of playing sports, itís always about the people I shared those moments with. Thatís what makes it special. Who you did it with.Ē

Which is why Foles has been telling everybody whoís asked over the last 24 hours why itís important for him to keep his NFL-record-tying seven-touchdown performance in Oakland in perspective.

He doesnít play sports for individual accolades or honors. He plays sports because he loves what a group of people can accomplish together.
mcnabbulous
QUOTE (Zero @ Nov 5 2013, 07:35 AM) *
Interesting choice of words. Not "love", not "next" and not "superstar." I realize he's from Austin but I'm curious if there was a reason you used that descriptor there.

Simply because I live here. For selfish reasons.

If Foles becomes a star, there will likely be more local interest. That will likely lead to more local coverage and bars showcasing the games.

There is a huge Saints fanbase here because of Brees.
Jax
QUOTE (Zero @ Nov 4 2013, 09:53 PM) *
That's a scary thought.

It's really quite normal for a less experienced NFL player. Very rarely does one achieve excellence without ever experiencing a little choking and locking up. It's human nature.
Jax
QUOTE (Zero @ Nov 5 2013, 07:53 AM) *
Same link:


It's the damn Dallas game that's got me leery. How could he play that bad?

Name a star in any sport and I will find you an example of his/her "Dallas game." If it becomes a recurring trend in important games that he plays terrible then it is an issue. Having one game where you couldn't hit the broad side of a barn with your passes is reasonable.

Honestly, injury may have had more to do with it than I think, but I just don't see how the groin injury can make you overthrow a wide open received by 10+ yards.
mcnabbulous
QUOTE (Jax @ Nov 5 2013, 11:23 AM) *
Honestly, injury may have had more to do with it than I think, but I just don't see how the groin injury can make you overthrow a wide open received by 10+ yards.

If an injury is in your head, it can cause all sorts of problems.

Jax
QUOTE (mcnabbulous @ Nov 5 2013, 11:37 AM) *
If an injury is in your head, it can cause all sorts of problems.

Hopefully the relation between the injury and the mental lock up was the issue. That could be much easier to solve than a full on choke.
nephillymike
You know how excel has that "undo" command? Methinks that this thread could use that safety command!!

I know I could have used it more than once over the years!!
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