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xsv
I'm not sure people can still question his willingness or ability to go deep, after a game like that. Guess we need to see if he can do it consistently, but he was certainly willing and able to do so in this game.

I do wish he was just a tiny bit faster. When there's a free rusher, he's not even fast enough to get out of the pocket to throw the ball away. As well as he can throw the ball, I'm jsut not sure that's something a QB can ever overcome. Dan Marino in his last season, in two knee braces and almost ready for a wheelchair as faster getting outside the pocket than this guy.
JeeQ
As far as mobility he reminds me a lot of Big Ben. He know he's 6'6 240+ so he rather just take the hit then try to escape. He set a record in college for most shots taken by a QB so apparently that's his thing laugh.gif

I'm anxious to see what he can do against Dallas. You have to get wins over winless teams, but the Cowboys are an entirely different monster. If he can go out there and take the W at home (and end that dreadful home losing streak) then Vick can consider himself Alex Smith'd. It'll be Foles team to carry until he proves himself incapable of doing so.
CT_Eagle
QUOTE (JeeQ @ Oct 13 2013, 09:29 PM) *
I'm anxious to see what he can do against Dallas. You have to get wins over winless teams, but the Cowboys are an entirely different monster. If he can go out there and take the W at home (and end that dreadful home losing streak) then Vick can consider himself Alex Smith'd. It'll be Foles team to carry until he proves himself incapable of doing so.



And what if Foles goes out and puts up 35 and no Ints or Fumbles vs Dallas but the Eagles still lose?
D Rock
QUOTE (JeeQ @ Oct 13 2013, 09:29 PM) *
As far as mobility he reminds me a lot of Big Ben. He know he's 6'6 240+ so he rather just take the hit then try to escape. He set a record in college for most shots taken by a QB so apparently that's his thing laugh.gif

I'm anxious to see what he can do against Dallas. You have to get wins over winless teams, but the Cowboys are an entirely different monster. If he can go out there and take the W at home (and end that dreadful home losing streak) then Vick can consider himself Alex Smith'd. It'll be Foles team to carry until he proves himself incapable of doing so.

That was a top 5 defense he pretty much carved up today. Certainly better than Dallas' defense.

Regarding his college days, he was literally the ONLY player on that terrible az team. That he stood in there and continued to play and take shots with that team is more a testament than detractor.
mcnabbulous
I can't wait until Chip really gets his QB. A guy that had a better combination of Vick and Foles' better strengths.

I'm absolutely not sold on Foles' deep passing ability yet. But that's not really the point. Ultimately I still he's just a guy.

At this point, given both of their success, I think Kelly's system is really QB friendly. I'm firmly in the Johnny Football camp. Hope we have the opportunity to draft him. I can only imagine what he would do in Chip's system.
D Rock
Oh god, no. I want nothing to do w that manziel turd.
CT_Eagle
QUOTE (mcnabbulous @ Oct 13 2013, 09:56 PM) *
I can't wait until Chip really gets his QB. A guy that had a better combination of Vick and Foles' better strengths.

I'm absolutely not sold on Foles' deep passing ability yet. But that's not really the point. Ultimately I still he's just a guy.

At this point, given both of their success, I think Kelly's system is really QB friendly. I'm firmly in the Johnny Football camp. Hope we have the opportunity to draft him. I can only imagine what he would do in Chip's system.


Getting a QB with Vick's mobility and Fole's pocket presence would be great. How many of those guys are out there though? Even if one is available next year when the Eagles pick do you go for that QB or do you start to improve the defense? To me this offense would put up a ridiculous amount of points if the Eagles had a defense that could consistently force 3 and outs.
mcnabbulous
I think both Manziel and Mariotta are both viable options. Sorry to start the draft talk already smile.gif
nephillymike
We have a guy who just put up two 100+ passer rating days, today against a top tier D.

We have the guy who he filled in for who was top ten in passer rating and was leading the NFL in yards per attempt (run and pass).

We just got back to .500 and have a real big game next week against the hated Cowboys.

And you are talking about a rookie QB next year?

That is sad.

Many of those eight or so projected first round picks won't be able to handle the NFL.

We are lucky enough to have two guys who can.

Enjoy it.
Zero
If the Eagles can improve significantly on defense, today's offense would do just fine. Too early to be talking draft, but they do need play makers on defense.
mcnabbulous
QUOTE (nephillymike @ Oct 13 2013, 05:34 PM) *
That is sad.


Im a sad man. In all seriousness, I get that it's not the time to start that conversation. I'm just not convinced Foles is the future.
With that said, he played well today. Something about the performance didn't instill much confidence though. It's great that we have 2 QBs who can make things happen though. Many teams don't have one.
CT_Eagle
QUOTE (Zero @ Oct 13 2013, 10:37 PM) *
If the Eagles can improve significantly on defense, today's offense would do just fine. Too early to be talking draft, but they do need play makers on defense.


Level of agreement 100%.

For the 2nd week in a row I was impressed with the play of Fletcher. There are several players on the Eagles defensive roster right now that will be useful on a quality defense. What they really need are some difference players that allow the existing players on the roster to become role players.
Rick
QUOTE (mcnabbulous @ Oct 13 2013, 06:47 PM) *
Im a sad man. In all seriousness, I get that it's not the time to start that conversation. I'm just not convinced Foles is the future.
With that said, he played well today. Something about the performance didn't instill much confidence though. It's great that we have 2 QBs who can make things happen though. Many teams don't have one.

Dude, how can ANYONE be sold on him yet. It's his 2nd year in the NFL! Why does everyone expect every kid coming out of college to immediately be HOF material??? Remember the days when a kid would sit and learn for 6 (or more) seasons before getting a chance?

I'm not sold on him either way just yet. So far, he's done quite well. Until he proves he can't handle it, I have to go with he CAN handle it because he has been. Can that change? Absolutely, again, it's his 2nd year. He's got a lot to learn.
mcnabbulous
QUOTE (Rick @ Oct 13 2013, 07:06 PM) *
Dude, how can ANYONE be sold on him yet. It's his 2nd year in the NFL! Why does everyone expect every kid coming out of college to immediately be HOF material??? Remember the days when a kid would sit and learn for 6 (or more) seasons before getting a chance?

I'm not sold on him either way just yet. So far, he's done quite well. Until he proves he can't handle it, I have to go with he CAN handle it because he has been. Can that change? Absolutely, again, it's his 2nd year. He's got a lot to learn.


It's the eyeball test. There is something about the way the ball comes out of his hands that just doesn't work for me. With that said, he has the best composure/pocket presence of any guy we've had under center since Garcia. I like the kid and hope he turns into an all-time great. Something just seems a bit off.
I agree with you regarding young QBs. People expect too much out of them given some recent early success stories. This is less about results and more with watching him actually toss the ball around.
He had a nice game today. I'm happy about that. He just doesn't strike me as the type that can get is where I want us to be.
JeeQ
QUOTE (CT_Eagle @ Oct 13 2013, 02:41 PM) *
And what if Foles goes out and puts up 35 and no Ints or Fumbles vs Dallas but the Eagles still lose?


Then we say "Thank you Nick Foles for being a quality backup QB, but now that Vick is healthy again he'll be starting until he proves himself incapable of doing so"

Vick didn't start today not because of bad play, but because of injury. The job is his until he loses it. But if Nick can keep the W's coming you absolutely do not bench him. More recovery time for Vick, and more practice for Foles.

We have a great problem right now of having two QBs who can run the offense effectively wub.gif


QUOTE (D Rock @ Oct 13 2013, 02:41 PM) *
That was a top 5 defense he pretty much carved up today. Certainly better than Dallas' defense.

Regarding his college days, he was literally the ONLY player on that terrible az team. That he stood in there and continued to play and take shots with that team is more a testament than detractor.


Absolutely agree as far as the Cowboy's D goes. Allowing 51 points last week was bad. It was Philadelphia Eagles defense bad! Which is why I fully believe Foles can take the W at home this Sunday.

As for his record of most hits taken I actually meant that as a compliment. If you play behind our O-Line being able to take a hit is a requirement. Guys like Kolb couldn't last five minutes behind this line. Seeing durability out of Foles is a huge relief.
Zero
QUOTE (mcnabbulous @ Oct 13 2013, 08:22 PM) *
He just doesn't strike me as the type that can get is where I want us to be.

I feel the same way but hope I'm wrong. I'd love to see him be a guy who could win it all so they can concentrate on fixing that D.

Even if it does improve as the year goes on, they still need some "special" players over there. Truthfully, I don't see any. There are some good players and a couple who are going to exceed their expiration date before long, but no one I can say is like Dawk, or Reggie, or even Trot.
mcnabbulous
QUOTE (Zero @ Oct 13 2013, 07:35 PM) *
I feel the same way but hope I'm wrong. I'd love to see him be a guy who could win it all so they can concentrate on fixing that D.

Even if it does improve as the year goes on, they still need some "special" players over there. Truthfully, I don't see any. There are some good players and a couple who are going to exceed their expiration date before long, but no one I can say is like Dawk, or Reggie, or even Trot.


Fixing the D is going to take a few offseasons. 2-3 solid drafts.
As for Foles, it's pretty clear he can succeed in Chip's offense. I guess my thought is that Chip has an opportunity to create an all-time great offense if he really got his guy in place. It's not as much a knock on Foles as it is a thought of what could be achieved with the perfect fit.
Zero
It seems an "all time great offense" will also require another good receiver to play opposite DJax. I don't put Cooper in that role although he did seem to show he has more than some thought. A healthy Maclin would fit the bill.
Jax
QUOTE (D Rock @ Oct 13 2013, 05:41 PM) *
That was a top 5 defense he pretty much carved up today. Certainly better than Dallas' defense.


Perhaps statistically but I'm not so sure that in a game situation you can draw the conclusion that if he put up 30+ against Tampa that he would do the same or more against Dallas.

Then again, we can't hold Dallas under 30 anyway.
Jax
QUOTE (mcnabbulous @ Oct 13 2013, 08:22 PM) *
It's the eyeball test.


I agree, and this is where Foles does pass the test for me. He looks like a QB should look and throws a catchable ball, mostly on target, makes solid decisions thus far and is competitive. The leader/competitive factor can't be underestimated.
Jax
QUOTE (JeeQ @ Oct 13 2013, 08:30 PM) *
Then we say "Thank you Nick Foles for being a quality backup QB, but now that Vick is healthy again he'll be starting until he proves himself incapable of doing so"

Vick didn't start today not because of bad play, but because of injury. The job is his until he loses it. But if Nick can keep the W's coming you absolutely do not bench him. More recovery time for Vick, and more practice for Foles.

We have a great problem right now of having two QBs who can run the offense effectively wub.gif


To me it is a simple question of whether you prefer the added threats that Vick poses or whether you prefer the better decision making in-play that Foles seems to have. Do you want to take care of the ball of make Sportscenter's Plays of the Day? To me that is kind of the decision here.

That said, I am a Foles supporter but I am not necessarily saying that one or the other is the right decision for next week because it is a tough choice...
MistahNickells
Foles played a great game bottom line.
Dr. Claw
QUOTE (mcnabbulous @ Oct 13 2013, 10:16 PM) *
Fixing the D is going to take a few offseasons. 2-3 solid drafts.
As for Foles, it's pretty clear he can succeed in Chip's offense. I guess my thought is that Chip has an opportunity to create an all-time great offense if he really got his guy in place. It's not as much a knock on Foles as it is a thought of what could be achieved with the perfect fit.


agreed.

and I don't get the Manziel dislike either. is it some contrived BS about his "character"? the guy isn't Andrew Luck but I've no doubt that the hype behind him is legit.

don't think the Eagles would be in draft position to get him anyway. All things equal the Eagles probably end up a one-and-done playoff team, so that'll take them out of any 1st round QB running.

he either goes to the Vikes or the Browns (back on tank status thanks to Brandon Weeden)
D Rock
QUOTE (Jax @ Oct 14 2013, 01:51 PM) *
Perhaps statistically but I'm not so sure that in a game situation you can draw the conclusion that if he put up 30+ against Tampa that he would do the same or more against Dallas.

Then again, we can't hold Dallas under 30 anyway.

I don't see Dallas slowing down our offense with either QB on the field. The game will come down to what our defense can do. We'll put up 30 points either way. Can we hold them to less?
Jax
QUOTE (D Rock @ Oct 14 2013, 12:53 PM) *
I don't see Dallas slowing down our offense with either QB on the field. The game will come down to what our defense can do. We'll put up 30 points either way. Can we hold them to less?

It very well may be a game with both teams in the mid-30's if not 40's. I think my point about the Dallas D may be that, if it comes down to which team can get the most stops, I don't feel like our D would be the choice.
D Rock
QUOTE (Jax @ Oct 14 2013, 05:25 PM) *
It very well may be a game with both teams in the mid-30's if not 40's. I think my point about the Dallas D may be that, if it comes down to which team can get the most stops, I don't feel like our D would be the choice.

Yeah. I gotta agree. Their offense stood toe to toe with the Denver Mannings. HRomo should carve our defense up. Our only hope is that he goes full HRomo in the 4th and shits the bed again.
Jax
QUOTE (D Rock @ Oct 14 2013, 02:11 PM) *
Yeah. I gotta agree. Their offense stood toe to toe with the Denver Mannings. HRomo should carve our defense up. Our only hope is that he goes full HRomo in the 4th and shits the bed again.

Or more like he goes Romo all game long and we get +3 turnovers.
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