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Dr. Claw
http://www.bleedinggreennation.com/2012/9/...oal-line-fumble

Can't wait to see the responses to this

edit: read the comments too. Vick's not let completely off the hook in this game, but this play in particular...
D Rock
QUOTE (Dr. Claw @ Sep 24 2012, 09:48 PM) *
http://www.bleedinggreennation.com/2012/9/...oal-line-fumble

Can't wait to see the responses to this

edit: read the comments too. Vick's not let completely off the hook in this game, but this play in particular...

Again.

If Vick doesn't fail to see the wide open Havili on first and goal, that play never happens. You can always shit on playcalling when your quarterback sux balls. It's just too easy.

Dr. Claw
QUOTE (D Rock @ Sep 24 2012, 06:50 PM) *
Again.

If Vick doesn't fail to see the wide open Havili on first and goal, that play never happens. You can always shit on playcalling when your quarterback sux balls. It's just too easy.


nice out. where's your analysis? any All-22s to offer this rebuttal?

Edit: found it on McNabborKolb.

Vick had defenders in his face on that throw. tossing it away to avoid the pick was probably the smart move. and why the fuck are they lining up in the damn I for a playfake on an obvious passing down in the first place?

the whole thing was a mess. I see opportunities for Vick to make those throws but that window was tight. an elite QB makes those throws (the three mentioned in the McNabbOrKolb article), but the Eagles don't have that. Make do with what you had. They were missing Maclin big time on those downs.

that third down line up was just asinine though. Reid should have kicked the FG if that pass wasn't going to work after 2 tries.
D Rock
QUOTE (Dr. Claw @ Sep 24 2012, 10:52 PM) *
nice out. where's your analysis? any All-22s to offer this rebuttal?

Edit: found it on McNabborKolb.

and Vick had defenders in his face on that throw. tossing it away to avoid the pick was probably the smart move.

all 22? It was first and goal on the 2, dude. Don't take an endzone angle to see the field on that play. In fact, your "evidence" from McDoucheorKolb uses only the TV angle as well. And havili was open and Uncovered in the flat. Early. Long before pressure got there. Look at his 3rd image. Vick is at the bottom of his drop. No defender within 5 yards of him and all blocked by a well formed pocket. Havilli has noone within 10 yards of him. This is WCO 101. And Vick missed it. And all you offered to bust my contention is proof of it's accuracy.

"Throwing the ball away" was a "smart move" with an eligible receiver uncovered in the flat? Brilliant. If he had time to throw the ball away, he had time to throw it to Havili. Assuming the dumb sunofabitch could read a phuqing nfl defense presnap anyway.

Finally, the next time "mcnabborkolb" exhibits any understanding on anything NFL related will be the first. He's a blogger for Krissake. Don't believe me? I'll use this very "analysis" as the only evidence required.
Dr. Claw
edit: since the reply I was replying to was edited, I'll address it here.

1) "can't read defenses pre-snap" = pre-packaged, unsubstantiated, easily repeated "criticism" on par with the bloggers you so easily deride.

2) by the time Vick was set, there were defenders in his face. Blaming him for not seeing Havili is fair, but that's about it.
D Rock
Tommy Lawlor???

laugh.gif laugh.gif laugh.gif

Seriously.

You offer McNabborKolb to refute my contention, but look at it again. Don't read his dipshit words. Just look at the images he offers (note: not from the all 22).

Specifically, look at the 3rd image.

Vick is at the bottom of his drop. No defender within 5 yards. Good protection. Solid pocket. Now in that same image. See Havili? No defender within 7 yards all alone at the 3 yard line. This is WCO 101. Stick the bottom of your drop, set and throw. Boom Boom Bang. It's an EASY 6.

But . . .

Vick plain missed it.

You can trot out any internet hack you want. But next time, you may wanna offer somebody who offers images that counter my point. Not one that actually makes it for me.

Everyone wants to cry about the lousy (and it was LOUSY) play call on 3rd and goal. But what's a coach to do when the 101 level play on first and goal works perfectly as designed but for the mental failure of your quarterback.

I hate rolling out a QB and cutting the field in half. Especially in the red zone. But when the guy can't read the whole field, you simple HAVE to cut it in half for him. Again. 101 level stuff here, mate.
mcnabbulous
I'd argue that wide open Clay Harbor on the second play was far more egregious.
D Rock
QUOTE (mcnabbulous @ Sep 24 2012, 11:15 PM) *
I'd argue that wide open Clay Harbor on the second play was far more egregious.

Like I said, what's a coach to do when the QB isn't seeing the field? He cuts the field in half for him to make it easier to read. He had open guys on 1st and goal. He had open guys on 2nd and goal. He's not seeing em. So roll him out and simplify the read.

No one wants to cut the field in half. But whattayagonnado when your quarterback is sucking hairy nutz?

Dr. Claw
QUOTE (D Rock @ Sep 24 2012, 07:16 PM) *
Like I said, what's a coach to do when the QB isn't seeing the field? He cuts the field in half for him to make it easier to read. He had open guys on 1st and goal. He had open guys on 2nd and goal. He's not seeing em. So roll him out and simplify the read.

No one wants to cut the field in half. But whattayagonnado when your quarterback is sucking hairy nutz?


I concede. there's no defense of those first two downs. Vick should be perfect on every play.
D Rock
QUOTE (Dr. Claw @ Sep 24 2012, 11:21 PM) *
Vick should be perfect on every play.

Now that's just silly. But for 100 million dollars, you'd hope for better than a 4 to 1 turnover to touchdown ratio.

Just sayin.
mcnabbulous
QUOTE (D Rock @ Sep 24 2012, 06:27 PM) *
Now that's just silly. But for 100 million dollars, you'd hope for better than a 4 to 1 turnover to touchdown ratio.

Just sayin.

Right. For the sake of this conversation, blaming that sequence on anyone other than Vick is pretty silly too.

At a minimum, he cost us 10 points.
D Rock
QUOTE (mcnabbulous @ Sep 24 2012, 11:30 PM) *
Right. For the sake of this conversation, blaming that sequence on anyone other than Vick is pretty silly too.

At a minimum, he cost us 10 points.

You look at Vick's numbers and IMO it's silly to blame anyone other than Vick for the entire shit show.

Could coaches have protected him by completely eschewing the team philosophy and essentially treating a 100 million dollar super star like a "game managing rookie" protecting him with JV playcalling? Perhaps. Has protection been spotty at times? Okay, but part of that is Vick's inability to read the field and taking too much time going from 1st to 2nd read.

This whole thing snowballs out of control once it gets going south, but it always starts with the mental failures under center.

ETA: Watching "the coaches show" right now on NFL network and both Billick and Mariuchi are pinning that whole end of half debacle 100% on Vick. For my money, I'll take their word over that of the internet hacks of the world. Especially when they offer a still shot that shows TWO open receivers and caption the image with "not much there." cool.gif laugh.gif rolleyes.gif laugh.gif
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