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GQSmooth
Vick was too antsy in the pocket last week. I'm at the point where I am giving up on a return to the 2010 version of Vick where he was a legitimate contender for the MVP. There is something different in his preparation now compared to 2010. I'm sure he knows the position better, but what I observed is a player hesitant to step into the pocket, waiting for the deep patterns to develop. I almost wonder if there is something different in the preparation when Kolb was around. Because without Kolb Vick has been different. That being said I'm not advocating pulling Vick since he is way more talented than anything else we have. But when he gets hurt and the way he continues to play he will get hurt, Vick will have a difficult time getting back on the field.
mcnabbulous
QUOTE (GQSmooth @ Sep 12 2012, 05:20 PM) *
Vick was too antsy in the pocket last week. I'm at the point where I am giving up on a return to the 2010 version of Vick where he was a legitimate contender for the MVP. There is something different in his preparation now compared to 2010. I'm sure he knows the position better, but what I observed is a player hesitant to step into the pocket, waiting for the deep patterns to develop. I almost wonder if there is something different in the preparation when Kolb was around. Because without Kolb Vick has been different. That being said I'm not advocating pulling Vick since he is way more talented than anything else we have. But when he gets hurt and the way he continues to play he will get hurt, Vick will have a difficult time getting back on the field.

Did you read the piece on Igglesblog about it? I think he hit the nail on the head. He's thinking too much, as a product of being coached. Unfortunately, he may be too old for coaching.
GQSmooth
QUOTE (mcnabbulous @ Sep 12 2012, 08:49 PM) *
Did you read the piece on Igglesblog about it? I think he hit the nail on the head. He's thinking too much, as a product of being coached. Unfortunately, he may be too old for coaching.

Yeah I read the piece. I have trouble blaming coaching because the only change is the o-line (Mudd). Its possible Vick is not trusting the o-line and sitting in the pocket. One concern I have is his deep drops. But someone mentioned the Brown's mostly played cover-2. There is no way cover-2 should confuse and frustrate Vick.
Dr. Claw
QUOTE (GQSmooth @ Sep 13 2012, 10:40 AM) *
Yeah I read the piece. I have trouble blaming coaching because the only change is the o-line (Mudd). Its possible Vick is not trusting the o-line and sitting in the pocket. One concern I have is his deep drops. But someone mentioned the Brown's mostly played cover-2. There is no way cover-2 should confuse and frustrate Vick.


here's why you should blame coaching.

one: Mike Vick's strengths and weaknesses are known entities.
two: they don't work with what they have.
three: the rest of the offense isn't quite working as well as they should be.

some other detailed reasons (addressing defenses and the O-Line):

1. One of the most effective things that defenses have done to Vick is to send secondary pressure, especially to the backside of runs / PA. On a dropback play, when a safety or CB creeps up into the box, Vick at times points him out (and assume that's a protection adjustment). When the secondary blitz is disguised and they don't go until after he is carrying out a stretch fake to the opposite side of the field, there is nothing he can do but react/respond. The Eagles need to do this out of the I and have the full back reverse and pick up that backside potential blitzer and crumple any DB they send. Eagles haven't done that in 2yrs.

2. In cases where the OL simply gets beat, one on one, that's not the fault of the QB (or, in the Eagles' case, QB and C). Its on the OL who got beat. Likewise, on a stunt, that's also on the line to pass off the guy to whoever's next and look for someone shooting the gap.

3. One other major factor is that the Eagles center is kind of weaksauce, compared to Eagles centers past (particularly Jamaal Jackson when he was healthy), he can get to the 2nd and 3rd level, which is a good thing. but on pass plays vs. a stout DT/NT, that's a problem, and results in no place for the QB to step up to.

I'm further more ignoring any talk of "BUT BUT HIS READS..." from those who are now hurdling over the cognitive dissonance fence WITHOUT them also acknowledging that there is a scheme problem as well. and has been despite whoever is at QB. McNabb, McMahon (puke), Garcia, Feeley, Kolb, Kafka, Young, and Vick... the same results, from a diverse cast of QBs. those of you really hoping that the backup can pull a Brady in 2001 when the Eagles don't run anything close to what the Pats or Peyton/Tom Moore Colts ran... are overreacting.

Vick's poor decision making is the primary reason why the game was close, if not a loss. but other elements of the stew exacerbate it. it isn't just playcalling, it's the lack of Jason Peters (which will rear its head more than once this season), it's RBs straight failing to block when obvious blitzes are happening, it's a whole lot of crap.

The Eagles offense (as called against the Browns) demands Peyton Manning at QB, and a Peyton that will make no mistakes. Since the only way the Eagles could get Manning is if they wound the clock back some 14-15 years and were lucky enough to draft him and at the same time switch to Andy Reid's offense... that's not happening. if they go 1-15 this year, Andy and Vick are gone, so it's a moot point.

As the dust settles, it's obvious the Eagles thought they were in a preseason game (another thing Andy tends to do: underestimate his opponent in an "anything can happen" league). It's shown. Let's move on from this topic.
Reality Fan
there was an interesting article on Philly.com on this.........while the Browns continued to play cover 2 the Eagles continued to try to throw deep........the writer wrote it after watching the game on nfl.com new all-22 which is the coach's film.
koolaidluke
QUOTE (Reality Fan @ Sep 13 2012, 10:44 PM) *
there was an interesting article on Philly.com on this.........while the Browns continued to play cover 2 the Eagles continued to try to throw deep........the writer wrote it after watching the game on nfl.com new all-22 which is the coach's film.


tard city. Typical Marty.

I guess the results Marty gets speak for themselves but trying to go deep against a good pass D committed to taking the deep ball away, particularly while your line is struggling just doesn't make sense to me.

Whatevs, you are who you are and we are a big play team. If Vick can just not throw ints we'll be set.
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