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- nephillymike   Draft Depth by Position   Dec 31 2016, 07:58 PM
- - Joegrane   "McLeod and believe it or not, J. Peters were...   Dec 31 2016, 08:27 PM
- - The Franchise   WR, CB, and o-line in later rounds. I'd wager...   Dec 31 2016, 08:27 PM
|- - El Cubano   QUOTE (The Franchise @ Dec 31 2016, 07:27...   Dec 31 2016, 08:56 PM
||- - Joegrane   If you want a WR in the later rounds you must be t...   Dec 31 2016, 11:04 PM
|- - Zero   QUOTE (The Franchise @ Dec 31 2016, 08:27...   Jan 1 2017, 06:46 AM
|- - nephillymike   QUOTE (Zero @ Jan 1 2017, 06:46 AM) I thi...   Jan 1 2017, 06:51 AM
||- - Zero   QUOTE (nephillymike @ Jan 1 2017, 06:51 A...   Jan 1 2017, 06:59 AM
||- - nephillymike   QUOTE (Zero @ Jan 1 2017, 06:59 AM) I did...   Jan 1 2017, 09:41 AM
|- - Rick   QUOTE (Zero @ Jan 1 2017, 07:46 AM) The E...   Jan 1 2017, 10:35 AM
|- - Zero   QUOTE (Rick @ Jan 1 2017, 10:35 AM) I alw...   Jan 1 2017, 10:53 AM
|- - Phits   QUOTE (Zero @ Jan 1 2017, 10:53 AM) Not s...   Jan 1 2017, 12:38 PM
||- - Eyrie   QUOTE (Phits @ Jan 1 2017, 05:38 PM) Prob...   Jan 1 2017, 12:47 PM
||- - Zero   QUOTE (Phits @ Jan 1 2017, 12:38 PM) Prob...   Jan 1 2017, 01:54 PM
||- - Eyrie   QUOTE (Zero @ Jan 1 2017, 06:54 PM) Commi...   Jan 1 2017, 06:19 PM
|- - Rick   QUOTE (Zero @ Jan 1 2017, 11:53 AM) Not s...   Jan 1 2017, 06:09 PM
|- - Zero   QUOTE (Rick @ Jan 1 2017, 06:09 PM) Becau...   Jan 1 2017, 06:54 PM
|- - Rick   QUOTE (Zero @ Jan 1 2017, 07:54 PM) I thi...   Jan 1 2017, 07:08 PM
|- - Eyrie   QUOTE (Rick @ Jan 2 2017, 12:08 AM) Well,...   Jan 2 2017, 06:09 AM
|- - Zero   QUOTE (Eyrie @ Jan 2 2017, 06:09 AM) I...   Jan 2 2017, 06:22 AM
|- - Eyrie   QUOTE (Zero @ Jan 2 2017, 11:22 AM) I...   Jan 2 2017, 06:35 AM
|- - nephillymike   QUOTE (Eyrie @ Jan 2 2017, 06:35 AM) Fair...   Jan 2 2017, 08:58 AM
|- - Zero   QUOTE (nephillymike @ Jan 2 2017, 08:58 A...   Jan 2 2017, 09:21 AM
- - Zero   Quick view of some potential FA: RB Le’Veon Bell...   Jan 1 2017, 10:46 AM
> Draft Depth by Position, CBS Draft Scout and Draftek
nephillymike
post Dec 31 2016, 07:58 PM
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To give all an idea of the projected depth by position, here are the count by prospects rated in the first, second and third rounds from two sources; CBS and Draftec

The three #s are first,second and third round grades

Pos......CBS...........Draftec.........Total 3 Rounds
DE.......6,3,2..........6,7,2...............11-15
CB.......5,3,3..........5,4,4...............11-13
WR......4,3,6..........4,3,4...............13 -11
OT.......2,4,3..........2,2,4.................9 - 8
DT.......1,5,3..........1,2,5.................9 - 8
OLB.....3,2,2..........4,1,3.................7 - 8
RB.......3,2,3..........3,0,3.................8 - 6
TE.......1,4,1...........1,2,2................6 - 5
S.........1,2,2...........2,3,1................5 - 6
QB.......3,0,1...........2,3,1................4 - 6
ILB.......2,1,2..........3,1,0.................5 - 4
OG........1,1,3.........0,3,1.................5 - 4
OC........0,2,2.........0,0,2.................3 - 2

So it looks pretty good for what I consider our top 2 needs, WR and CB, but a little iffy for getting a RB if they go where projected. This will change greatly, but wanted to give a snapshot.

FWIW, 16 of the Eagles 22 starters were drafted in the first three rounds.

Only Barbre and Bradham 4th, Carroll 5th, Kelce 6th, McLeod and believe it or not, J. Peters were UDFA. Nothing like getting a HOF as an UDFA!
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Joegrane
post Dec 31 2016, 08:27 PM
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"McLeod and believe it or not, J. Peters were UDFA. Nothing like getting a HOF as an UDFA!"

Indeed, however....

"The Eagles acquired Peters from the Bills for the 28th overall pick in the 2009 NFL Draft. The Eagles also sent a fourth-round pick (121st overall) in the 2009 NFL Draft and a late conditional pick (6th round) in the 2010 NFL Draft."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jason_Peters

A late 1st, 4th and 6th is still quite nice for a Pro Bowl OT with a long career.
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The Franchise
post Dec 31 2016, 08:27 PM
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WR, CB, and o-line in later rounds. I'd wager that a playmaker at WR will make our RB's look much better.


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El Cubano
post Dec 31 2016, 08:56 PM
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QUOTE (The Franchise @ Dec 31 2016, 07:27 PM) *
WR, CB, and o-line in later rounds. I'd wager that a playmaker at WR will make our RB's look much better.


I second this, but also would like to see the O-line get help before our defense.
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Joegrane
post Dec 31 2016, 11:04 PM
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If you want a WR in the later rounds you must be thinking a laterally quick but undersized slot guy.

Which position on the O Line are you interested in?

I think Seumalo is the OC of the future so they might use a 3rd or 4th rounder on the L OG of the future.

I would not mind if they would use a later pick on a backup OG/OT to replace M Tobin. I have no idea how an undrafted guy who has accomplished so little has lingered so long.

QUOTE (El Cubano @ Dec 31 2016, 08:56 PM) *
I second this, but also would like to see the O-line get help before our defense.

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Zero
post Jan 1 2017, 06:46 AM
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QUOTE (The Franchise @ Dec 31 2016, 08:27 PM) *
WR, CB, and o-line in later rounds. I'd wager that a playmaker at WR will make our RB's look much better.

I think our RB situation is pretty dismal, even with a solid #1 receiver. Sproles is a great mismatch toy but he's never been a guy who can be an every down back. They have three complementary backs in Sproles, Barner and it seems Smallwood. Mathews is the guy but he's injured way too often and has always seemed to have fumble problems. Sproles is 33 and could either play until he collects SS or go down on any given play. Barner is who he is and can carry the ball 5 or 6 times a game and Smallwood is still an unknown.

The Eagles need a starting RB, #1 WR and a #1 CB ... not necessarily in that order. Would you pass on Fournette or Cook if they're there when we pick, especially considering the supposed better WR and CB depth in the draft?
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nephillymike
post Jan 1 2017, 06:51 AM
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QUOTE (Zero @ Jan 1 2017, 06:46 AM) *
I think our RB situation is pretty dismal, even with a solid #1 receiver. Sproles is a great mismatch toy but he's never been a guy who can be an every down back. They have three complementary backs in Sproles, Barner and it seems Smallwood. Mathews is the guy but he's injured way too often and has always seemed to have fumble problems. Sproles is 33 and could either play until he collects SS or go down on any given play. Barner is who he is and can carry the ball 5 or 6 times a game and Smallwood is still an unknown.

The Eagles need a starting RB, #1 WR and a #1 CB ... not necessarily in that order. Would you pass on Fournette or Cook if they're there when we pick, especially considering the supposed better WR and CB depth in the draft?

Did you see where Sproles said 2017 would be his last season?

With Mathews eight month recovery and likely cut by the Eagles, that makes RB all the more of a must draft and/or free agent signing.
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Zero
post Jan 1 2017, 06:59 AM
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QUOTE (nephillymike @ Jan 1 2017, 06:51 AM) *
Did you see where Sproles said 2017 would be his last season?

With Mathews eight month recovery and likely cut by the Eagles, that makes RB all the more of a must draft and/or free agent signing.

I didn't see either the Sproles comment or the 8 month Mathews part. Would you take Fournette or Cook with our #1? If not, would you take Mixon later?
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nephillymike
post Jan 1 2017, 09:41 AM
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QUOTE (Zero @ Jan 1 2017, 06:59 AM) *
I didn't see either the Sproles comment or the 8 month Mathews part. Would you take Fournette or Cook with our #1? If not, would you take Mixon later?


I haven't looked at any specific draft prospect yet so I have nothing to go on yet. Around combine time I'll get into it and hopefully have something educated to add. But, if the question is would I take a higher rated RB in round one than a lesser rated WR or CB, my answer is yes. I'm always a best player at a position of need proponent.

With free agency starting March 7th, I will be putting together my annual shopping list.

The NFL draft isn't until April 27th, so it's free agency first, then the kids.

We have the cap resources to make decent moves in free agency, and the draft resources to make some improvements in the draft. It should hold our interest for a few months.
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Rick
post Jan 1 2017, 10:35 AM
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QUOTE (Zero @ Jan 1 2017, 07:46 AM) *
The Eagles need a starting RB...

I always find this funny. How do you think another RB would do any better behind this line? Sure, you may get a little more production out of him but, until this OL is fixed, you're wasting any RB you bring in.

Currently, the Eagles are 10th in the league in rushing but 25th in the league in passing. This is a passing league. They need to fix the OL, which will help whomever they have running the ball. They need better WRs WAY more than they need a better RB.
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Zero
post Jan 1 2017, 10:46 AM
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Quick view of some potential FA:
RB Le’Veon Bell 24
RB Eddie Lacy GB 26
CB A.J. Bouye 25
CB Morris Claiborne 26
CB Trumaine Johnson 27
CB Stephon Gilmore 26
WR Terrelle Pryor 27
WR Alshon Jeffery 26
WR Josh Gordon 25
DT Bennie Logan 27
Thoughts?

Depressing that I'm looking at FA and the draft so soon.
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Zero
post Jan 1 2017, 10:53 AM
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QUOTE (Rick @ Jan 1 2017, 10:35 AM) *
I always find this funny. How do you think another RB would do any better behind this line? Sure, you may get a little more production out of him but, until this OL is fixed, you're wasting any RB you bring in.

Currently, the Eagles are 10th in the league in rushing but 25th in the league in passing. This is a passing league. They need to fix the OL, which will help whomever they have running the ball. They need better WRs WAY more than they need a better RB.

I think the starting OL is in better shape than either RB or WR. It looks like Peters has another year or two, Barbre is serviceable, Kelce is a bit undersized for this offense but OK, Brooks is solid and Johnson is solid. They have Big V and Seumalo coming along as young depth. Still needs attention, but not as much as a seriously underperforming WR corps and a RB rotation that has a 33 yr old, a rookie question and two yawns. Not sure why people are downplaying the RB need.
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Phits
post Jan 1 2017, 12:38 PM
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QUOTE (Zero @ Jan 1 2017, 10:53 AM) *
Not sure why people are downplaying the RB need.

Probably because RB isn't the critical piece that it used to be. We should have seen this coming with the death of the FB some years back. Who is the last SB team to have an elite RB? Running back "by committee", that's the way to go. Better let the other franchises draft RB high and then get them on the cheap after their rookie contract expires.


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"Bless my eyes this morning, Jah sun is on the rise once again. The way earthly things are going, anything can happen." Robert Nesta Marley (1945 1981)
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Eyrie
post Jan 1 2017, 12:47 PM
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QUOTE (Phits @ Jan 1 2017, 05:38 PM) *
Probably because RB isn't the critical piece that it used to be. We should have seen this coming with the death of the FB some years back. Who is the last SB team to have an elite RB? Running back "by committee", that's the way to go. Better let the other franchises draft RB high and then get them on the cheap after their rookie contract expires.

Or pick a cheap rookie in the middle rounds.

If we can draft a complement to Smallwood this year then we're set at the position. Keep Sproles for his last season and then look for a return specialist in 2018's draft.


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Zero
post Jan 1 2017, 01:54 PM
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QUOTE (Phits @ Jan 1 2017, 12:38 PM) *
Probably because RB isn't the critical piece that it used to be. We should have seen this coming with the death of the FB some years back. Who is the last SB team to have an elite RB? Running back "by committee", that's the way to go. Better let the other franchises draft RB high and then get them on the cheap after their rookie contract expires.

Committee or not we need a RB
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Rick
post Jan 1 2017, 06:09 PM
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QUOTE (Zero @ Jan 1 2017, 11:53 AM) *
Not sure why people are downplaying the RB need.

Because, even with the problems they've had on offense--and playing from behind passing like crazy--they're still 10th in the league in rushing. I can't understand why people think RB is such a huge need for this team.

Not to mention what many of us have been saying about it's not needed in the NFL like it used to be.
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Eyrie
post Jan 1 2017, 06:19 PM
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QUOTE (Zero @ Jan 1 2017, 06:54 PM) *
Committee or not we need a RB

We just don't need to spend a high pick on one.

Cut Mathews and draft a power guy in rounds 2-4 to complement Smallwood. Sproles and Barner/Marshall/Watson would then round out a good group.


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Zero
post Jan 1 2017, 06:54 PM
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QUOTE (Rick @ Jan 1 2017, 06:09 PM) *
Because, even with the problems they've had on offense--and playing from behind passing like crazy--they're still 10th in the league in rushing. I can't understand why people think RB is such a huge need for this team.

Not to mention what many of us have been saying about it's not needed in the NFL like it used to be.

I think it's a need because their two leading rushers are Sproles who is 33 going into his last year and Mathews who is most likely gone.
QUOTE
Player Att Yds Yds/Att Long TD
Ryan Mathews 155 661 4.3 30 8
Darren Sproles 94 438 4.7 25 2
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Rick
post Jan 1 2017, 07:08 PM
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QUOTE (Zero @ Jan 1 2017, 07:54 PM) *
I think it's a need because their two leading rushers are Sproles who is 33 going into his last year and Mathews who is most likely gone.

Well, they were paid to be the leading rushers. We don't know what the other guys can do as the leading guy/guys. Obviously, they need to replace these two, my point is, it's not a HUGE need in that there is absolutely NO need to spend a high draft pick (I wouldn't even use a 2nd round on one) based on how the NFL is played and how the Eagles did with what they've got. The more pressing need is to get the OL and the WR fixed and the CB situation. I'd put the RB issue behind all 3 of these.
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Eyrie
post Jan 2 2017, 06:09 AM
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QUOTE (Rick @ Jan 2 2017, 12:08 AM) *
Well, they were paid to be the leading rushers. We don't know what the other guys can do as the leading guy/guys. Obviously, they need to replace these two, my point is, it's not a HUGE need in that there is absolutely NO need to spend a high draft pick (I wouldn't even use a 2nd round on one) based on how the NFL is played and how the Eagles did with what they've got. The more pressing need is to get the OL and the WR fixed and the CB situation. I'd put the RB issue behind all 3 of these.

I'm a big proponent of having a strong OL, but don't think it needs major work this year.

Peters, Seumalo, Kelce, Brooks, Johnson backed up by Vaitai and Barbre is a good starting point. Depth at G and a challenge for Kelce are needed but I'm intrigued why you think this is a priority ahead of RB.


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Zero
post Jan 2 2017, 06:22 AM
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QUOTE (Eyrie @ Jan 2 2017, 06:09 AM) *
I'm a big proponent of having a strong OL, but don't think it needs major work this year.

Peters, Seumalo, Kelce, Brooks, Johnson backed up by Vaitai and Barbre is a good starting point. Depth at G and a challenge for Kelce are needed but I'm intrigued why you think this is a priority ahead of RB.

I'm not sold on Seumalo. I saw a couple of whiffs that ended up in hurrys or losses yesterday. I know he hasn't played much, but at this stage I think Barbre is still the starter. I also think they'll be looking for a someone to groom to replace Kelce. The bigger DT/NG just abuse him.
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Eyrie
post Jan 2 2017, 06:35 AM
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QUOTE (Zero @ Jan 2 2017, 11:22 AM) *
I'm not sold on Seumalo. I saw a couple of whiffs that ended up in hurrys or losses yesterday. I know he hasn't played much, but at this stage I think Barbre is still the starter. I also think they'll be looking for a someone to groom to replace Kelce. The bigger DT/NG just abuse him.

Fair enough.

But it's still a nice group if you start Barbre and have Seumalo as depth. He's also been talked about as a potential C so I'd like a decision made on where he will play and have him concentrate on either G or C.


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nephillymike
post Jan 2 2017, 08:58 AM
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QUOTE (Eyrie @ Jan 2 2017, 06:35 AM) *
Fair enough.

But it's still a nice group if you start Barbre and have Seumalo as depth. He's also been talked about as a potential C so I'd like a decision made on where he will play and have him concentrate on either G or C.

Last I checked, about five games ago, Kelce was ranked the 33rd best center in the league, behind every other starter and one sub who played a good portion of the year.

I don't have a subscription to PFF, so I don't know the latest, but it can't be great.

Part of the Kid's bad mechanics is due to the fact he can't step up many times because Kelce is getting blown up.

All of this, plus his cap hit, plus the viable options of Wiz and Seamalo make this cut a no brainer.
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Zero
post Jan 2 2017, 09:21 AM
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QUOTE (nephillymike @ Jan 2 2017, 08:58 AM) *
Last I checked, about five games ago, Kelce was ranked the 33rd best center in the league, behind every other starter and one sub who played a good portion of the year.

I don't have a subscription to PFF, so I don't know the latest, but it can't be great.

Part of the Kid's bad mechanics is due to the fact he can't step up many times because Kelce is getting blown up.

All of this, plus his cap hit, plus the viable options of Wiz and Seamalo make this cut a no brainer.

Kelce did well when he was blocking big fat guys who were winded by up tempo and when he was pulling and getting downfield blocks. When he has to hold a block on that rested big fat guy he gets mauled.
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