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> When I heard about Banner, 1st thing I thought of was...DAWK
Birdwatcher
post Jun 7 2012, 08:55 PM
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I think that was the trigger for his end here, then today I heard Westbrook was on WFAN saying the same thing. He added in the TO fiasco of 05 as something he could have avoided by simply converting the following year's roster bonus into a current signing bonus, I had not heard that before. I think Reid would have paid Dawk what he wanted, but Banner talked him out of it (I still think Andy had final say), but I think Banner convinced him he wasn't worth what Denver was paying. I know Lurie loved him (Dawk) and I think Joe swayed Jeff too. Now if Dawk flopped this might not have happened, but his success and our secondary and D mess proved it was a costly mistake.

According to Lurie they talked about him leaving after 2010 and given Lurie's long time friendship they kept him around, but pushed into a silent corner. The last thing I remember him saying was the famous 'all in' comment before last year, then nothing. For all the platitudes floated today, Banner was essentially canned, only obscured by the 'bigger' thing he is looking for, like bringing a Lombardi to Philly wouldn't be big? Bottom line, Andy Reid just won the power struggle, though it seems like Banner screwed himself in the long run.

OK, so after I write this I find this link, Ray Didinger says it much better than I could...

http://www.csnphilly.com/football-philadel...&feedID=692
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Reality Fan
post Jun 7 2012, 11:37 PM
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what you say makes a lot of sense but some of what they said rings true also......it can't be denied that Roseman has had an increased role in player contracts before last year so the grooming and the succession part is true. They dumped Heckert so Howie could keep rising....and they love Smolenski from a business standpoint. That being said it is hard to imagine that there was not a foot in the ass because banner is not leaving for a specific job....he is just gone.........the office he mentions keeping is a buddy office......I would love to know what his severance package is.



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koolaidluke
post Jun 8 2012, 01:23 AM
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I don't think Banner ever really had much power. He was always unpopular with the fans and after last year Lurie feels extreme pressure to make changes, doubly so since both Reid and Castillo are staying. Similarly, Lurie has forced Reid to be more open with the media as a way to reduce some of the heat the organization is taking.

Banner was great at cap management but didn't have the PR skills. I'm thankful for his service but nobody is irreplaceable.


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TGryn
post Jun 8 2012, 05:55 AM
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  • I'm doubtful that anything could have satisfied TO in '95, given his history with every other team of self-destructing himself after being there a year or so, but they might have patched things up enough to make another run that year...not that it would have mattered after McNabb was lost for the season.
  • This is how many organizations handle a "firing" when they don't want to outright fire someone: either give them a series of rotten/impossible assignments so they quit on their own, or gradually stop giving them anything important to do and slowly farm out their responsibilities (the "Siberia" treatment).
  • Anyone who the WIP crowd hates as much as they did Banner has to be doing something right. Very good cap guy, decent manager, poor at PR. Wish him luck in his future work.


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Jerome Brown Exp...
post Jun 8 2012, 08:19 PM
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QUOTE (TGryn @ Jun 8 2012, 06:55 AM) *
  • I'm doubtful that anything could have satisfied TO in '95, given his history with every other team of self-destructing himself after being there a year or so, but they might have patched things up enough to make another run that year...not that it would have mattered after McNabb was lost for the season.
  • This is how many organizations handle a "firing" when they don't want to outright fire someone: either give them a series of rotten/impossible assignments so they quit on their own, or gradually stop giving them anything important to do and slowly farm out their responsibilities (the "Siberia" treatment).
  • Anyone who the WIP crowd hates as much as they did Banner has to be doing something right. Very good cap guy, decent manager, poor at PR. Wish him luck in his future work.


Yes, yes and yes.
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mcnabbulous
post Jun 9 2012, 06:49 AM
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Seems like the writing was on the wall and last year's big FA binge was his last hurrah, so to speak. This year's signings seem to be very Reid driven, given an attempt to take care of guys in-house and improve the locker room.
I'm happy to see him go. He was clearly a shrewd businessman and successful at that, but he had no business making football decisions.
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make_it_rain
post Jun 11 2012, 09:41 AM
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QUOTE (TGryn @ Jun 8 2012, 06:55 AM) *
  • Anyone who the WIP crowd hates as much as they did Banner has to be doing something right. Very good cap guy, decent manager, poor at PR. Wish him luck in his future work.




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koolaidluke
post Jun 11 2012, 01:47 PM
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QUOTE (make_it_rain @ Jun 11 2012, 10:41 AM) *


I can't see your posted images, or any images really. How do I find out what is wrong with my browser?


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koolaidluke
post Jun 11 2012, 01:48 PM
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If I can't see images posted on message boards, I don't want to live


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Dreagon
post Jun 11 2012, 05:07 PM
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QUOTE (TGryn @ Jun 8 2012, 05:55 AM) *
  • I'm doubtful that anything could have satisfied TO in '95, given his history with every other team of self-destructing himself after being there a year or so, but they might have patched things up enough to make another run that year...not that it would have mattered after McNabb was lost for the season.


True. The man played with a couple of the easiest going, most laid back QBs in the NFL and still couldn't get along with them. Say what you want about Romo and McNabb, but these guys weren't about bustin their receiver's balls.
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make_it_rain
post Jun 12 2012, 08:48 AM
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QUOTE (koolaidluke @ Jun 11 2012, 02:47 PM) *
I can't see your posted images, or any images really. How do I find out what is wrong with my browser?



What browser are you running? If it's IE then frankly you don't deserve to be able to view images in a browser.


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koolaidluke
post Jun 12 2012, 02:43 PM
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google chrome


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Dreagon
post Jun 12 2012, 02:52 PM
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QUOTE (koolaidluke @ Jun 12 2012, 02:43 PM) *
google chrome


Interesting. I run Chrome too, and I was going to say I couldn't see the picture as well.
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Birdwatcher
post Jun 12 2012, 09:50 PM
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QUOTE (Reality Fan @ Jun 8 2012, 12:37 AM) *
what you say makes a lot of sense but some of what they said rings true also......it can't be denied that Roseman has had an increased role in player contracts before last year so the grooming and the succession part is true. They dumped Heckert so Howie could keep rising....and they love Smolenski from a business standpoint. That being said it is hard to imagine that there was not a foot in the ass because banner is not leaving for a specific job....he is just gone.........the office he mentions keeping is a buddy office......I would love to know what his severance package is.


He was instrumental in turning Lurie's 200M investment into a billion dollar cash cow. Banner has been well compensated by his long time friend for services rendered, no doubt about that. But as this plays out and more people are talking this smacks of two reasons, public PR #1 and locker room stability #2. Lurie cut him off last year when he finally realized whenever Joe opened his mouth in the media, bad things came out...at least bad perceptions.

As for the locker room, have you seen the Westbrook interview?

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/...ncussions-more/

He talks about Banner among other things, and confirms Joe's bulldog approach to players...might be surprised at his description of his own negotiation. Sounded like he routinely treated players as commodities without treating them like people, just general respect even seemed lacking. How many years have we had at least a few players in the locker room not satisfied with their contract? That has radically changed this off season, they mended a lot of fences in that respect. Hopefully we will see the fruit of that this season with a more focused and cohesive team. (Westbrook also talks about Assante, caught me by surprise, but it rang true)

I bet we are going to see something else this year too, a slightly more approachable Reid. I doubt he will ever give us a Buddy-like show, but I suspect he will try and be more conversant and pleasant with the press. I also expect that when they have a bad game he will still be gruff, but instead of standing by every stupid mistake he makes, he might actually admit making a mistake (but he will never throw a player under the bus, he can't and won't change that)

I'd feel a lot better if Peters hadn't gone down, but they did the best available thing they could when it happened, so what else can you ask for? I like Westbrook's prediction of they they will do, and I hope he is right.

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HOUSEoPAIN
post Jun 13 2012, 11:05 AM
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QUOTE
Lurie cut him off last year when he finally realized whenever Joe opened his mouth in the media, bad things came out...at least bad perceptions.


The guy's voice on the radio and his attitude is just plain unlikeable - add to that the fact that he'll only give interviews to Eskin, and you have a problem. Once you actually see his face, and put a picture to those words? We might as well have C. Montgomery Burns as our PR guy.

QUOTE
I also expect that when they have a bad game he will still be gruff, but instead of standing by every stupid mistake he makes, he might actually admit making a mistake


Not happening. It's just who he is, a 'talking to' from Lurie isn't gonna change it.

QUOTE
(but he will never throw a player under the bus, he can't and won't change that)


Tell that to David Akers.....


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